Newsflash: Spain "not the Arabian desert of 14 centuries ago..."

[yaroslav]

The iman tried to conver that in a trial against the islam... Fortunately there were normal muslim people in the trial that said the thruth: to bite womans isn't part of nowadays, modern islam.

In a broader sense, the free speech is more restricted in Europe than in USA. I don't know too many examples, but nazi apology, for instance, is forbidden in German (and in Spain), as is racism apology, violence apology, etc.

I don't know what model is best (USA or Europe) but I'm not unconfortable with our current model.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

By that definition only the US is civilised.

Exactly...

Actually, I think the correct solution lies somewhere between US attitude and rest of 1st world attitude.

You have the right to free speech right up to the point where you're telling somebody to violate another person's rights.

[CerberusIV]

I don't know whether this is an issue in the USA (I suspect not) but in Europe there is an increasing tension between the authorities and "extremist" Islamic types who place Islamic law above the civil law of the countries they happen to be in. That leads to situations like this one where someone is promoting [their own interpretation] of the Koran and advocating something that is illegal in the country concerned.

Inciting/encouraging others to commit a criminal act is AFAIK an offence in many countries.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Kitten is a rat.

That French bastard...

Allons, enfants de la Patrie,
Le jour de gloire est arrive,
Contre nous de la tyrannie
L'etendard sanglant est leve,
L'etendard sanglant est leve.

[Drake Tungsten]

You have the right to free speech right up to the point where you're telling somebody to violate another person's rights.

That's any awfully vague standard there. What's to stop the government from (for example) censoring pro-communist speech? Forcibly redistributing property and wealth would violate many people's rights, which would seem to make any calls to implement such a policy worthy of censorship under your rules. What is chegitz going to do in your world?

[KrazyHorse]

There's a difference between suggesting changing the laws and suggesting that you simply violate current laws.

That's why it's illegal to attempt to change the government of the US by force, but not illegal to vote.

[KrazyHorse]

Which is why, IMO, as long as a group like NAMBLA stays on the legal advocacy side of things they should be allowed. Once they cross over and tell someone to rape children they should be broken up.

[KrazyHorse]

It is not a vague standard; it's the one which is most commonly used.

[Drake Tungsten]

There's a difference between suggesting changing the laws and suggesting that you simply violate current laws.

Communist revolution isn't about "changing the laws".

That's why it's illegal to attempt to change the government of the US by force, but not illegal to vote.

But it's not illegal to call for the change of the US government by force, nor should it be.

[KrazyHorse]

AFAIK it is so illegal to call for violent overthrow of US gov't.

[KrazyHorse]

What's your stance on inciting violence Drake?

If I'm part of a mob and I then stand up and tell everybody to kill someone I see on the other side of the street then am I not legally responsible for what that mob does with my suggestion?

[Drake Tungsten]

AFAIK it is so illegal to call for violent overthrow of US gov't.

Not to the best of my knowledge, but I may be wrong.

Where's Imran when you need him?

[Drake Tungsten]

What's your stance on inciting violence Drake?

I think it is bad and would never do it myself...

[The Viceroy]

Its not the average person on the street that concerns me regards to such teaching, for them, free speech would only show the fool for what he was.

Its the mindless (and often indoctrinated from birth) moron's who hang on these imam's every word that concern me. Also, the tendancy for those of the same leanings, to support them come what may (or at least, apologise for them).

Just as the racist twists logic to fit his hatred, I find too many doing the same with such teaching.

Unfortunatly, there really are people out there, who will believe regardless, every word that is told them.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
AFAIK it is so illegal to call for violent overthrow of US gov't.

It was under the Smith act, but im quite sure that was repealed some time ago.