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Newsflash: Spain "not the Arabian desert of 14 centuries ago..."

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  • Newsflash: Spain "not the Arabian desert of 14 centuries ago..."

    The prophet Muhammed would not approve of you, Mr. Mustafa. Good on Spain for convicting this low life scum.



    Imam Convicted for Advice on How to Beat Wives


    MADRID (Reuters) - A Spanish court sentenced an imam to 15 months in prison Wednesday for writing a book instructing husbands how to beat their wives without leaving bruises.

    A lawyer for the Egyptian-born imam, Mohamed Kamal Mustafa, 44, vowed to appeal, telling state radio the ruling was unjust.

    The Barcelona court found Mustafa guilty of provoking violence on the basis of gender in his book "Women in Islam," published in 2000.

    The book recommends that in the case of a "rebellious woman" a husband should attempt "serene dialogue" and if that fails, refuse to sleep in the same bed.


    If rebellion persists, the woman should be struck in a "symbolic" way and "without excesses," the court order cited the book as saying.


    "If one needs to use blows, they should be administered to specific parts of the body like the feet and hands, using a light and thin stick so it will not leave scars or bruising on the body," read an excerpt from the book quoted in the ruling.


    In the trial Mustafa argued that much of his advice was based on the Koran, the Muslim holy book.


    But the court said today's society was "not the Arabian desert of 14 centuries ago," and ruled that some passages violated the penal code and women's constitutional rights, partly because Mustafa was a prayer leader with influence over people at his mosque near Malaga, on the southern coast.


    Spanish media reported that Mustafa would not go to jail because first time offenders in Spain who receive terms of less than 28 months usually have their sentences suspended.


    The court also fined Mustafa 2,160 euros ($2,742) and ordered copies of the book to be confiscated, according to the written court order.


    The court said parts of the book addressing menstruation, childbirth, makeup and clothing promoted sexual discrimination that was "intolerable and criminally reproachable."



    01/15/04 08:47


    © Copyright Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved. The information contained In this news report may not be published, broadcast or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of Reuters Ltd.
    The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

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  • #2
    I have a small question: Why is it that Europe seems hellbent on preventing any free speech it considers "immoral" in some fashion?
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    • #3
      Beating your wife is generally not considered "free speech" by civilized peoples. Beyond that, I think Europeans have, at the subconcious level, had enough of constant violence and hate on their continent. Well-meaning legislation is still tainted with prejudices and ends up being this side of hateful.
      The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

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      • #4
        The book recommends that in the case of a "rebellious woman" a husband should attempt "serene dialogue" and if that fails, refuse to sleep in the same bed.

        If rebellion persists, the woman should be struck in a "symbolic" way and "without excesses," the court order cited the book as saying.

        "If one needs to use blows, they should be administered to specific parts of the body like the feet and hands, using a light and thin stick so it will not leave scars or bruising on the body," read an excerpt from the book quoted in the ruling.


        While it ain't right, why has this led to such an uproar and banning? I'm with Tass: why is Europe hellbent on preventing free speech?
        “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
        - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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        • #5
          Beating your wife is generally not considered "free speech" by civilized peoples.


          He wasn't convicted for 'beating his wife', but writing a book.
          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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          • #6
            dp
            Last edited by The Mad Monk; January 16, 2004, 03:50.
            No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

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            • #7
              "Thin light stick"?

              the way they were carrying on about it, you'd think he was discussing phonebooking.
              No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

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              • #8
                Something about "inciting violence" comes to mind. Probably don't want like-minded morons getting the idea that it's ok to beat their wives since some imam wrote a book. One less opportunity to shirk responcibility for your own actions.
                The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

                The Weighted Companion Cube is cheating on you, that slut.

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                • #9
                  Something about "inciting violence" comes to mind. Probably don't want like-minded morons getting the idea that it's ok to beat their wives since some imam wrote a book. One less opportunity to shirk responcibility for your own actions.


                  So you consider this 'inciting violence' so that it can be banned? What if you have a book saying if your child gets rowdy, you should smack him firmly on the butt, but without excess. Should that book be banned because it may incite child abuse?

                  I'm just glad that in the US something like this wouldn't be banned. Just because we think it's wrong doesn't mean we should silence it. That's also part of freedom of speech... freedom for the one we don't like.
                  “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                  - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                  • #10
                    This wasn't in the United States, it was in Europe (Spain). Yes, I support this censoring over there because Europe has a major problem of lingering hatreds. They don't need additional crap being brought into the equation. If the imam wasn't going to like the fact he couldn't beat wives, he should have moved to Saudi Arabia. He lives in Spain, he should have known better, now he faces the consequences.
                    The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

                    The Weighted Companion Cube is cheating on you, that slut.

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                    • #11
                      Judging from the views in this thread I think I'll write a book on the best ways to abuse children without leaving any physically traceable evidence. Sounds like it'd be a winner in the States. Yay for my free speech!
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                      • #12
                        If you ask me, somebody slipped up by letting this case leak out to the public. If you're going to do censorship, don't do it the half-assed European way.
                        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
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                        • #13
                          Yes, I support this censoring over there because Europe has a major problem of lingering hatreds.


                          So if you have lingering hatreds you shouldn't have free speech? And are you saying that the US has NO lingering hatreds dealing with race?

                          If the imam wasn't going to like the fact he couldn't beat wives, he should have moved to Saudi Arabia. He lives in Spain, he should have known better, now he faces the consequences.


                          Is there any proof he beat his wife? And he isn't facing the consequences for 'beating' (there is no evidence he has done so), but for writing about beating. He obviously thought he had free speech rights, something that is a reasonable assumption. I guess you think he should have 'known' better.

                          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                          • #14
                            Yay for my free speech!




                            I'm glad you've finally learned what freedom is all about from the people who invented it.
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
                              Is there any proof he beat his wife?
                              Wasn't the purpose of the book to instruct how to beat the wife without leaving any evidence?
                              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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