Death to France!

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Dispite what a few female Uncle Tom's say the vial is just another way which men attempt to repress women. It is a truly barbaric & demeaning practice and I applaud the French for ending that repression.

If you try to tear than viel or than headscarf from than muslim woman in El Paso you are going get punch out by the woman. There are many million of muslim woman worldwide who wear the veil and headscarf because they want to an they wear it for Aliah(God).

Here is than outspoken Muslim woman the former Prime Minister of Pakistan twice.

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by Tamerlin
The problem is not what your definition is but what is the definition of religion.

Atheism can not be considered as a religion simply because the non existence of god can not be proved... it is way too easy.

What bothers me a lot is that most of the people who say that atheism is a religion are actually believers themselves as if it were their ultimate defense. Those that have the faith do not have to defend themselves of anything, they believe and that's all... at least that is enough for me.

Than Federal Court in America declare Atheism than religion in acase where some Atheist in a public square display at christmas time than sign attacking the Christian religion by saying that Christ never exsit at all.
The Court order the sign remove as than religion cannot display religish display in a public square Atheist cannot display they religish veiwpoint in a public square.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Ned
Tamerlin, the only "rational" position is that there is no conclusive evidence one way or the other. If you begin to adopt positions that are not based on evidence, you are extending yourself into "faith."

Let's be serious Ned... there is no conclusive evidence that spirits and spiritism are true, so not believing in spirits and spiritism is a religion.

If we follow your reasoning I can say that not believing in L. Ron Hubbard's scientology is a religion... not believing in ghosts is a religion... not believing in psychic powers is a religion... not believing that there are Vulcans and Klingons somewhere in the galaxy is a religion...

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff

Than Federal Court in America declare Atheism than religion in acase where some Atheist in a public square display at christmas time than sign attacking the Christian religion by saying that Christ never exsit at all.
The Court order the sign remove as than religion cannot display religish display in a public square Atheist cannot display they religish veiwpoint in a public square.

As far as I am concerned I don't care a dime about the opinion of a court about what is a religion and what is not, whatever the country of the said court.

If you read again your post you will see that there is no evidence at all that the Federal Court is considering the atheists as members of a religious order, the decision seems to have more to do with the principles of equality and respect of the others than anything else.

I would really like to know why the believers are so hardly trying to convince themselves that atheists are also members of a religion... and why it seems so important for them.

It's really weird...

[Spiffor]

UPDATE - UPDATE - UPDATE

You French bashers will be delighted to hear the idiocy has risen to a whole new level today

Education minister Luc Ferry, in charge of the making of the law, has announced today his intention, not only to ban Muslim scarves, Jewish kippas ans Christian crosses, but also:
- Bandanas (casual headwear covering the whole hair; it is fashionable across the whole female youth)
- "Islamic beards"
- Sikh turbans
- something else, from a minor religion.

Besides, the linguistic headache continues.
The old law banned "ostentatoire" religious symbols. Chirac now wants to ban "ostensible" religious symbols. But the Parliament wants to ban [/i]"visible"[/i] religious symbols. However, in an attempt of conciliation, the Parliament accepts to ban "ostensiblement visible" religious symbols. Finally, the Minister decided to take the courageous decision to only ban religious symbols that are worn "ostensiblement"

[You'll find the words surprisingly close to each other. This is normal. I still fail to see the subtlety between all these words ]

[Monk]

Spiffor, a bandana, is that the thing worn by that gorgeous girl who sang "Tu es foutu"?

[Spiffor]

I have no idea what you are talking about, sorry

A bandana would be this:


You can easily understand why France bans it

[Ned]

Originally posted by Tamerlin


Let's be serious Ned... there is no conclusive evidence that spirits and spiritism are true, so not believing in spirits and spiritism is a religion.

If we follow your reasoning I can say that not believing in L. Ron Hubbard's scientology is a religion... not believing in ghosts is a religion... not believing in psychic powers is a religion... not believing that there are Vulcans and Klingons somewhere in the galaxy is a religion...

Tamerlin, you seem to be missing the difference between not believing in something without evidence and affirming that something does not exist without evidence.

[Ben Kenobi]

"Mieux vaut entendre ça que d'être sourd".

Merci. Je comprends.

Leave it in French next time. Colloquialisms don't translate well.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Ned

Tamerlin, you seem to be missing the difference between not believing in something without evidence and affirming that something does not exist without evidence.

I have not missed the point, I was just pointing at the contradiction in the reasoning behind the "atheism is a religion" theory... though I would replace theory by nonsense as far as I am concerned.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Leave it in French next time. Colloquialisms don't translate well.

OK!

[Ned]

Perhaps we misunderstand one another. Atheism to me is the denial of the existence of God (or in the Hof example, Jesus Christ). Agnosticism is the lack of belief in God due to lack of evidence.

When Hof said that Atheism is a religion, he assumed you understood that he was talking about the brand of Atheism that denies the existence of God.

[Ecthy]

Death to Ned!

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Ned
Perhaps we misunderstand one another. Atheism to me is the denial of the existence of God (or in the Hof example, Jesus Christ).

True, I don't believe in any god...

When Hof said that Atheism is a religion, he assumed you understood that he was talking about the brand of Atheism that denies the existence of God.

... and I don't think any god exists. I don't believe in any higher principle governing our destiny... and thus that can't be a religion.

As Jean-Paul Sartres wrote, "man is free and it is a burden to be free". As far as I am concerned this is a burden I am happy to carry on my shoulders.

[Spiffor]

Tamerlin:

This is mostly a word's issue. The "atheists" in America are actively denying the existence of God, and basically believe in its inexistence. In France, the "athées" are generally much less strong in their convictions, and show a lack of belief, rather than a belief in nothing.