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Growing up in an irreligious household.

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  • #31
    Don't forget that I'm interested in your parents as well - were they believers, did they stop going to church the second their youngest kid left the house, were they apathetic/hostile to religion, etc?

    In my home, the religion instruction essentially went like this:

    1. Went to church every time I spent a Sunday with my maternal grandparents. About 7 times a year for a 7year period.
    2. Christmas, Easter, and for about a 3 month period Dad was on some church committee when I then had my First Communion. We switched churches, but their hearts weren't in it and we pretty much just stopped going other than Christmas, Easter, and then not every one of those.
    3. I went through a period about a year ago where I started going to church again, more as a response to the Sophie question as anything else. Laura was more resistant, though spiritual matters concern her far more than I and I haven't gone in a few months.

    My mother was raised Catholic and was more devout than my father, who changed religions to marry her (a man who changes religions for a woman has greater concerns in his life than pleasing God), though it wouldn't surprise me that my mother's devoutness was a partial result of the need to put on a act for the neighbors and business associates whom themselves are going to church to see who's there and who isn't.

    When she died (1968, I was 1 year old), my father remarried and the new wife (also named Betty) was Catholic as well. They separated and divorced in 1976/77, but the church attendence had plummeted to zero by then because of my unfortunate accident referenced above. Once my grandparents came to visit and we all blissfully went off to the 10:30 Mass, serenely unaware that the church had been closed for 4 months. My father gamely said (and this is a by-God direct quote) "This wasn't in last weeks bulletin!"

    My grandparents laughed about that for years. Laughed and raged, for they considered religious education important.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Asher
      But religion is a waste of time and only serves as building some kind of crutch and escapehatch to use instead of being a man and finding your own morals and beliefs.
      But that's a belief and not a demonstrable fact. Plenty of people who are wise in the ways of science are lazy crutch-draggers themselves.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Asher
        Not to mention the pedophile priests, the money laundering ministers, and the *****y choir women.
        Which has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Drop it.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
          JohnT: Yes. I am not familiar with being a parent, but as a Catholic, it is definitely your duty to raise her spiritually as well as a physically and mentally, it is your duty to bring her up in the faith. When she is older she will be in a better position to choose to continue in her faith or not, but while chidren are young they need to be instructed on religion. If you feel inequipped to ever discuss any matters, check what religious education services they have at your parish, and consider enrolling her in CCD.

          Of course, Apolyton is a forum that is largely athiest and can be rather hostile to religion. It isn't the best place to go for advice on matters religious, it is far better to discuss your concerns with a priest.
          Thanks, Shi.

          Odin, if you don't understand how Shi's response was germaine to this thread and yours wasn't, you're nowhere near as smart you want us to think you are. You and Asher can start your own Catholic Bigotry thread if you want. Please, by all means.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Odin


            I think my bullsh!t detector just went off. Go back in to your little bigoted wonderland, you papist.
            Since you're not normally this kind of a dumbass, I'll actually break with (my) tradition and give you a warning. Any more snide or bigoted comments like this, and you'll be gone for a week.

            And I don't want to be bothered with any PM's that it was a joke, or whatever - you got warned, not banned, so simply keep quiet and follow orders.
            When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."

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            • #36
              My parents were semi-religious. We read a few prayers a day and I read the Quran (in Arabic) but my brother didn't. So they were raising us in the faith, but not too strictly AT ALL. So me and my bro (I think) both grew up to be fairly non-religious.

              All I can say is that it is your decision to make in the end, and our opinions don't matter worth a damn . I'd lean towards no, myself, and hopefully a future wife will agree .
              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Sn00py
                Also, for Evolution, we would of course accept that there is change amongst life, and that although Evolution is still in a Theory-Fact transition at this present time, we believed that Evolution is fact. quite easily, but not ruling out the fact that we could be wrong.
                Evolution is in no such state, it is both a theory and a fact. The fact of evolution, which has been proven conclusively, is that all living beings evolve. This is scientifically indisputable. It is a "theory" in the scientific sense, which doesn't mean a "guess" or "hypothesis." It is a "theory" in the same sense that gravity is a "theory." A scientific theory is simply a way of explaining observed phenomena, not making a "guess."
                Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
                  JohnT: Yes. I am not familiar with being a parent, but as a Catholic, it is definitely your duty to raise her spiritually as well as a physically and mentally, it is your duty to bring her up in the faith. When she is older she will be in a better position to choose to continue in her faith or not, but while chidren are young they need to be instructed on religion. If you feel inequipped to ever discuss any matters, check what religious education services they have at your parish, and consider enrolling her in CCD.
                  How is this his duty? It's his duty to give his kid the best means for making her own decision about her beliefs. Shoving Catholicism, or any other ideology, down her throat isn't giving her the tools to make a critical decision later on, it's just preparing to potentially be a drone for some religious sect.

                  Leave her be, and then let her choose her own path later on. If neither JohnT nor his wife are religious, it's simply unconscionable to foist a religious upbringing on their child. If anything, it will end up making her more hostile towards relgion, as she will see her parents as hypocrites who didn't practice what they preached.
                  Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
                    Of course, Apolyton is a forum that is largely athiest and can be rather hostile to religion.
                    Originally posted by Odin
                    Go back in to your little bigoted wonderland, you papist.
                    Thanks for proving Shi's point, Odin.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Shoving Catholicism, or any other ideology, down her throat isn't giving her the tools to make a critical decision later on, it's just preparing to potentially be a drone for some religious sect.


                      Well, do note that I think that it is silly to ask a religious person not to instruct their child in their own religion.

                      It's not that Laura and I don't think it can't be done (raising a moral child in a non-religious household), I've just never had the need to actually think about the subject before, and am interested in how others were raised in such an environment. We had a long talk today about this and thought a couple of threads would be a good idea - the other thread is here, if anybody is interested. Our big problem is that in growing up in the US SE, we've never really seen it done on a large, noticable scale - it seems that everybody goes to church down here (even though I know that's not the case) and that we were both raised with the idea that religion is important, even if you miss church.

                      But we don't really think that way any more.

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                      • #41
                        "How is this his duty? "

                        Simple. It is his duty according to the teachings and traditions of the church JohnT believes in.
                        "I'm moving to the Left" - Lancer

                        "I imagine the neighbors on your right are estatic." - Slowwhand

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                        • #42
                          If you are looking more places to start threads where you will likely get more of a Catholic angle, check out the forums at www.catholic.org . They run towards the conservative side, but they are all very smart and for the most part nice people.
                          "I'm moving to the Left" - Lancer

                          "I imagine the neighbors on your right are estatic." - Slowwhand

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
                            "How is this his duty? "

                            Simple. It is his duty according to the teachings and traditions of the church JohnT believes in.
                            Apparently, you didn't read:

                            Originally posted by JohnT
                            We aren't really religious. At all.
                            JohnT isn't religious, which is the whole point of this thread.
                            Tutto nel mondo è burla

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Shi: "members of", not necessarily "believes in." As I said in the previous post, Laura and I discussed this at length today and one of the points that I mentioned is that we consider ourselves Catholic merely because of inertia, because we were raised in it and find it rather comforting in its droning sameness. But, too, we also can't be bothered to really check out other churches because, hell, we don't even bother to go to the one that we are comfortable with. And so we remain "Catholic," not out of desire but out of disinterest.

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                              • #45
                                For the record, I was raised Catholic, though we were never strict with observances. We only went to church on Easter and Christmas, to get ashes for Ash Wednesday, etc. My mom wouldn't cook meat on friday. Other than that, we didn't observe much. I had faith for a while into my early teens, but it gradually eroded in the face of examination. I became an atheist for a spell, then realized that wasn't the answer for me either, and eventually be came agnostic, which I am today. Although religions often have policies or beliefs I disapprove of, I recognize the enormous benefits mankind has derived from religion, benefits that largely outweigh the drawbacks.

                                Still, I think you must have faith in a religion to be a strict adherent of it or to raise a child in it. A person need not be raised in a spiritual vacuum simply because he or she is not exclusively instructed in a particular religion, be it Catholicism or Buddhism.

                                You can always raise your daughter as a Unitarian Universalist. It's soft and squishy enough not to cause permanent damage.

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