Nuclear Weapons found in Iraq!!!!

[Agathon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Nuclear Weapons found in Iraq!!!!

Originally posted by DRoseDARs


So instead of a "smoking gun" they've uncovered a "rusting, poorly-maintained gun."

What's up today? People seem to be funnier than usual. Silly season?

[DRoseDARs]

For the record (again...), I've always believed Saddam had WMDs hidden somewhere inside Iraq (or Syria potentially). That's never been a question for me (though I have strong doubts about them having much in the way of developing nuclear weapons).

My thing is that was the justification for the war: Saddam has wmds and is an imminent threat to the West, led by the USA, and is scant months away from having nuclear weapons.

The burden of PROOF is on the Bush Administration. He risks very bad backlash from home and abroad if he does not find what he said he knew about. Grasping straws won't cut it, side-stepping questions won't cut it, down-playing setbacks won't cut it, shouting-down critics won't cut it...only hard physical proof will be apropriate.

I don't care about Bush's political future. One way or another he'll be gone, be it in 1 year or 4 more. My concern is the damage he has already done to the United States' image in the eyes of the rest of the world and the damage he is likely to continue to contribute until his presidency ends. Years after he is gone this country will still be smarting from it's poor world image. Whether one cares about what the rest of the world thinks or not is immaterial: even the most isolated nation still has contact with the outside world. The USA, being the Western Industrialized country that it is, WILL be affected by world opinion of it.

My generation and the one after mine will be the ones who have to repair the damage when it's our turn to lead the nation...

[GePap]

Originally posted by The diplomat
Mark my words: we'll find the WMDs, it is only a matter of time. And when we do, all those naysayers will look really really stupid and it will be their own fault because they were determined to politicize everything rather than wait for the truth!

Yeah, if they find a couple of chemical shells, it shows Iraq was an imminent threat and would have colluded with Al qaida to kill a billion Americans......

The WMD excuse for war was weak before the war, and now shows itself to have been far, far weaker than that.

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by The diplomat
Mark my words: we'll find the WMDs, it is only a matter of time. And when we do, all those naysayers will look really really stupid and it will be their own fault because they were determined to politicize everything rather than wait for the truth!

There very well may be nuclear or biochem weapons out there in Iraq, or have been destroyed in the past year or so. Show me real evidence because none of what has been found to date can seriously be used to say that such weapons exist/ed.

[notyoueither]

DRoseDARs, I think you are rather over-wrought on the topic. It's pretty simple. Many people are against war, no matter the reasons. It is a divisive issue. There was a war. Opinions were strongly divided. The war is over. People will get over it, by and large.

What people will not get over, at least some of them, is the power of the United States in the world relative to everyone else. The only way for you to fix that would be for the United States to go entirely isolationist and disband much of its military. There are people who would really like to see that happen. Do it and they will have won.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Big Crunch
There very well may be nuclear or biochem weapons out there in Iraq, or have been destroyed in the past year or so. Show me real evidence because none of what has been found to date can seriously be used to say that such weapons exist/ed.

Chemical warfare shells have already been found, have they not?

[Cruddy]

Originally posted by notyoueither


Chemical warfare shells have already been found, have they not?

Yes, a dozen or so were found.

They are, of course, completely useless without a chemical weapon to go inside them.

[Dauphin]

Edit - x post what Cruddy said.

[GePap]

Originally posted by notyoueither


Chemical warfare shells have already been found, have they not?

Empties. 12 empty shells burried in a dump (and found by inspections, no less) do not an argument for war make. Hell, in the same time span the inspectors, without 100% cooperation, have found more than Coolition troops.

[notyoueither]

The point is, they weren't supposed to have them.

Nor were they supposed to have bits and pieces of uranium enrichment machinery buried about the country-side in peoples' gardens.

If anyone wants to maintain that Saddam and company were no threat to peace, and that they had relinquished all desire for nasty weapons to use against people (their own and others) then agreement on the issue of invading Iraq is impossible to reach.

[GePap]

Originally posted by notyoueither
The point is, they weren't supposed to have them.

Nor were they supposed to have bits and pieces of uranium enrichment machinery buried about the country-side in peoples' gardens.

If anyone wants to maintain that Saddam and company were no threat to peace, and that they had relinquished all desire for nasty weapons to use against people (their own and others) then agreement on the issue of invading Iraq is impossible to reach.

So war was necesary to get the Iraqis to hand in 12 empty chemical warheads and old bits burried for 12 years of past nulear porgrams, cause otherwise..what?

Give me a break. The inspections, ahd they been allowed to continue would have turned up most of th stuff that had any importance. The other stuff, would have been sidenotes.

Stick to the "we liberated the iraqi people" reason, cause the WMD one is really laughable.

[reds4ever]

Originally posted by notyoueither
The point is, they weren't supposed to have them.

Nor were they supposed to have bits and pieces of uranium enrichment machinery buried about the country-side in peoples' gardens.

If anyone wants to maintain that Saddam and company were no threat to peace, and that they had relinquished all desire for nasty weapons to use against people (their own and others) then agreement on the issue of invading Iraq is impossible to reach.

Maybe Saddam knew he had numerous bits of junk lying around that he shouldn't have? He could n't come clean on the illegal material, so he tried to bareface it out.

Was he ever offered an amnesty? (i can't remember?)

[Cruddy]

Maybe this new "search for WMD" is a cover for a new oil prospecting program.

Be interesting to see what turns up under the rosebushes and azaelias.

[DRoseDARs]

Notyoueither, I'm one of these people who still believe that evidence, not opinion, are what matter. Yes, there are people who are still going to piss and moan about every little thing anyone who is not them does - they can sod off - but the fact of the matter is this war, it's "justifications," on top of everything already done by the Bush Administration, WILL be remembered by enough people, both in the halls of power and the general public, that the damage done will affect the USA's near future. Political clout, economic influence, military cooperation. All will be affected to one degree or another. How much? Only time will tell...

It's easy for you to sit in Canada and say what you said. Afterall, when was the last time CANADA pissed the whole world off? You've been fortunate that you haven't fallen victim to the ugly mess of Guilt-by-Association with the USA. The UK already had a history in the Middle East, so they've got their own problems with the region; it's my perception that you Canadians haven't really inherited the stigma of bad-blood over there from either country.

Must be hard to be Canadian, what with the whole "No one hating us and declaring Jihad on us all the time" racket you got going up there...

[Sandman]

Hey, this is not too bad a find. I mean, it's better than when they try to pass mustard gas off as a doomsday weapon.