The Hamas answer to Abu Mazen's New Goverment

[Spiffor]

Absolutely Oerdin. You hit the nail on the most important immediate reasons.
Misery is a secondary immediate reason, but not the most important one in this situation.

But the long-term reason for hate is that Arabs feel cheated and humiliated, and feel they have to fight to put an end to this humiliation.

[Sirotnikov]

What bothers me [b]most[/i] is that these murderers can gather so much support from the Palestinian population and the Arabs at large.

Actually the main "problem" is that 60% of Hamas activity is charity. That is how it gains support and people's trust.

[Sirotnikov]

Terrorist Attack on Tel-Aviv

Suicide bomber detonated himself next to a pub in Tel-Aviv walkway, adjacent to the US embassy.

Police Figures: 35 injured 4 dead + bomber.

[Giancarlo]

When my relatives were in a building right across from an ETA bomb that went off in Spain, I spare no sympathy for murderers anywhere no matter their situation.. Kill all of the terrorists that are responsible for this.

[Sirotnikov]

I'm beginning to use my Avatar and Signature for news updates.

[I Am Jeff]

I think the most important thing is to not let this stop or slowen the development of the Abu Mazen's Goverment. The quicker the Israel and Palestine resolve their differences and the quicker they set up the Palestinian state, the faster the crack down on groups like hamas can be stopped.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by I Am Jeff
I think the most important thing is to not let this stop or slowen the development of the Abu Mazen's Goverment. The quicker the Israel and Palestine resolve their differences and the quicker they set up the Palestinian state, the faster the crack down on groups like hamas can be stopped.

[Dinner]

The creation of a Palestinian government will be a major step, but, it will only be a step forward if it is run by people who do not support terrorism. Unfortunately, Arafat is a dyed in the wool terrorist and he will never be anything else.

[Sirotnikov]

I Am Jeff - Please understand that we are suspicious and weary of this.

In 1993, we thought that the faster we give the Palestinians self rule, and give them weapons, the faster their police force will reign in the terror.

However, instead, they used the freedom from IDF patrols to create bases of terror, and palestinian police either ignored or actively participated in terrorism since.

We have already tried advancing the political process, hoping the terror would go away. It had backfired, creating far more terror than ever.

That is why, now we see it as the palestinian's turn to make unmatched concessions. Now they have to begin cracking down on terror, and expect that when it is down to reasonable levels, we will resume negociations.

It's also a matter of trust. We have intelligence evidence, interrogation reports, and actual admittal in papers, that the PA executive bodies and police forces have either knowingly turned a blind eye, funded, supported, incited and even participated in terrorist activities.

[Sirotnikov]

Furthermore, Arafat is still the President of the PA and also, lest you forget the chiarman of PLO - representing Palestinians abroad as well. He still holds significant powers.

Furthermore, he demanded, and got, to put 14 of the ministers he liked in the government. Those are the same people that have been there up until now, who are close to Arafat and will be a majority in the 24 seat government.

How's that for "reform"?

[Dinner]

The best possible senerio I can see coming out of this is for Abu Mazen to work his way into the government and then for Arafat to die. Then maybe their will be a Palestinian leader who really wants to turn Palestine into a modern democracy instead of a privite kleptocracy & militant camp like Arafat has done.

[Sirotnikov]

NEWS UPDATE:

3 dead Israelis
1 bomber dead
59 injured - 1 in critical condition, 8 in with severe injuries.

Israeli Police is now in hot search for a car that reportedly left the bomber near the cafe, and sped away fromt he spot. I imagine huge areas of the territorial borders will be closed.


Abu Mazen has reportedly condemned the event.

[Spiffor]

**** !
Many more injuries than before I hope they'll heal

[Felch]

Injuries can refer to pretty terrible mutilation. The way they make them sound in the media you'd think people just got the wind knocked out of them.

[Sirotnikov]

Spiff, a good portion of those are probably shock injuries. About ~20 are lightly injured (this can also include things which emergency medicine consider light: burnt skin, scars, broken limbs that are easy to fix).

That means around 30 physical injuries, and 30 people lightly scarred or shocked.

My numbers are based on numbers heard on TV, and may not be updated or exact. It often so happens that medium and light injuries get to the hospital later, and thus are added to the list, because they are picked up by private citizens rather than ambulances.

Another good thing: several of the critical conditions lessened to severe.

Furthermore there's 1 dead less than I thought (previously was reported that 4 deaths do not include suicide bomber).