Multiplayer Strategy Guide

[quinns]

CheckMate,

How many cities do you have when you switch from Theocracy to Democracy? 40 is good. Your gold should be pretty good by then, with two to four monopolies generating most of your science also. Make sure you have Marketplaces and Banks in your monopoly centers. Once you switch to democracy, keep 90% of your military units in your cities and don't build any more military if you can help it. You will see that the advance to Fascism under Democracy takes only 10 to 20 turns. Your science and gold are better while under Democracy compared to Theocracy. Under Fascism be careful to only build the Fascist units if you plan to attack or be attacked. You will lose your Fascists once you switch to a more advance government after Fascism.

[TheBirdMan]

It actually works as Math said it would - this tip/bug/feature building infrastructure below a newfounded city (edit/added: both tasks should be started/made in the same turn).

In my challengegame against him, a city on plains rose its food production at turn 3 from its founding by 15 food (advanced farm).

So we clearly have to decide how this should be used in future and running games - FAST.

(More added: I do not think use of this can make a great difference in "old" games - but in new and fairly new games it sure matters.)

[Mathemagician]

Originally posted by TheBirdMan

(More added: I do not think use of this can make a great difference in "old" games - but in new and fairly new games it sure matters.)

ive experienced that in the very beginning of the game you rarely want to save PWs until you found the city.
in the late game it doesnt matter too much cause your civ is doing well already anyway.
so it is only really important in the mid-game (say cities 5-20)

[quinns]

Originally posted by TheBirdMan
It actually works as Math said it would - this tip/bug/feature building infrastructure below a newfounded city (edit/added: both tasks should be started/made in the same turn).

In my challengegame against him, a city on plains rose its food production at turn 3 from its founding by 15 food (advanced farm).

So we clearly have to decide how this should be used in future and running games - FAST.

My view is that this is not a bug, but a tip. It makes sense that you could build a city on top of a radar station or listening post, for example. I have never used it, but I think it should be allowed.

:edit: Now that I understand how this works better, I change my mind. This is a bug and should be avoided.

[Mathemagician]

Originally posted by quinns


My view is that this is not a bug, but a tip. It makes sense that you could build a city on top of a radar station or listening post, for example. I have never used it, but I think it should be allowed.

so do i
(my vote does count thrice, doesnt it ? )

[Mathemagician]

oh in case the other improvement trick wasnt clear:

you have to build non-transport, non-infrastructure tile improvements (keep, surveillance tower, sonar, ...) on a tile and WHEN IT IS FINISHED build the actual infrastructure you want (roads, farms, ...)
this way you will have all three on the tile.
it might even be possible to build one thing out of each column of the build menu this way, e.g. surveillance tower, keep, road AND farm.
havent fully tried yet, but i think it depends on the right order and that each one is FINISHED before you build the next one. (except roads and farms and the likes, which you can build simultaneously)

[Mathemagician]

and here is atually a strategic hint of mine:

PW optimization

i often collect PWs by setting the global PW value in a way that the least of it goes unused, while still providing a good production overall.

for example, if you have only one city its pretty simple:
once the thing youre building is finished in just one turn, set the PW as high as possible while still finishing the order in one turn.
in detail: set PW up by 10%, press F1 again (dont need to close the menu, just actualize it by F1) until the order is NOT done in 1 turn anymore, then set the PW value BACK by 10%. this is the optimal value.

okay, this was quite simple, and has already been said here (for science though if i remember it right)
well. science is a different thing, cause the surplus science is carried over to the next research, whereas surplus production is not.

okay back to the PW optimizing.
what now if you have more than 1 city ?
well, then you have to prioritize between minimum loss of work and maximum speed of production.

going to the extremes, you trivially optimize production speed at 0% PW.
on the other hand you would minimize the production loss (due to the above mentioned over-production) by going from 100% PW down until at least one city finished production in one turn, and not further.
this is because if you go down further to have more cities finish, the additional production pumped into the previous cities goes to waste.


the following is a list of some methods i usually use as rule of thumb to optimize between both goals (maximum production speed and minimum production loss), starting at the extreme of maximizing speed, going down to the extreme of minimizing loss.
which method i choose mainly depends on how urgent i need PWs or production.

NOTE: for just one city, all points except point 1 are equivalent.
again remember, hit F1, change PWs and without closing the list, just hit F1 again.
oh, and sorting by 'time to finish production' is a good idea as well.

1.) 0% PW always maximizes speed (trivially)

2.) increase PWs as long as possible so that each city will still finish its production in the SAME number of turns as with 0% PW (complicated for more cities and not my favourite)

3.) increase PWs as long as possible so that each city which finished its production in 1 turn at 0% will still finish its production in 1 turn. (this is my favourite if i want maximum production speed, while gaining a few PWs, and am not currently building important and rush buy expensive things like wonders)

4.) increase PWs (still starting at 0%) until for the first time the same number of 1's in the 'turns to finish' column comes twice, then go as far as possible up without changing that number again.

5.) like point 4, but you dont start at 0% PW but at a number you at least want to have, like for example 20%.

6.) like step 7 (!), but start at the MAXIMUM amount of PWs you want to have, for example 80%.
(my favourite for gaining much PWs when there is nothing important or urgent to produce)

7.) go down from 90% until for the first time the same number of 1's appears again, then one step up again. (that is, where you had the same number at 10% more PWs)

8.) from 100% PW go down by 10% steps until the first time at least one city finished production in 1 turn.
this will minimize production loss.
of course you can minimize it even more by micro-managing all your cities each turn. but that isnt the topic here.

of course, another, more simple, rule of thumb which goes in somewhere in the middle, is just constantly setting PWs to a fix value like 30%.
converging towards infinite cities, this would be equivalent to method 5 and 6, which would then be equivalent to each other as well. but with infinite cities who would have any of these problems anyway ?

hope reading all that stuff was helpful for you

[Maquiladora]

Originally posted by TheBirdMan
It actually works as Math said it would - this tip/bug/feature building infrastructure below a newfounded city (edit/added: both tasks should be started/made in the same turn).

In my challengegame against him, a city on plains rose its food production at turn 3 from its founding by 15 food (advanced farm).

So we clearly have to decide how this should be used in future and running games - FAST.

(More added: I do not think use of this can make a great difference in "old" games - but in new and fairly new games it sure matters.)

This trick is not so well known in CtP2 MP, but most, if not all "good" MP players start by building any new city on a farm. I didnt find this out by myself, i played a few players that out grew me in the ancient age pretty quickly and their cites grew so fast to size 4 that they built their initial buildings faster and were more prepared later on. Im sure its not as great in ctp1 because farms only add +5 food but its still something to think about with adv farms.

[Mathemagician]

Originally posted by Maquiladora

Im sure its not as great in ctp1 because farms only add +5 food but its still something to think about with adv farms.

yes. thats why i build mines instead of farms early on.
damn. that was my most secret trick..
what a fool i am

[quinns]

Math, I tested your theory about building a city on advanced farms and mines. In both cases, the building of the city destroyed both farms and mines and made no difference to the food or production of the city. Are you sure that you are not referring to CTP2??

:edit: I think I see what you mean. You have to build the infrastructure and found the city ON THE SAME TURN to make it work. Is that right? If that works... I change my mind. I didn't understand fully the first time. That is a bug and a bug exploit. It should be banned from future challenge games, and generally banned from organized multiplay, in my opinion.

[Mathemagician]

Originally posted by quinns
Math, I tested your theory about building a city on advanced farms and mines. In both cases, the building of the city destroyed both farms and mines and made no difference to the food or production of the city. Are you sure that you are not referring to CTP2??

are you sure you built them in the same turn as the city, quinns ?
yes, i am referring to CTP 1.

[quinns]

... (from above edit) ... I think I see what you mean. You have to build the infrastructure and found the city ON THE SAME TURN to make it work. Is that right? If that works... I change my mind. I didn't understand fully the first time. That is a bug and a bug exploit. It should be banned from future challenge games, and generally banned from organized multiplay, in my opinion.

[Mathemagician]

Originally posted by quinns
... (from above edit) ... I think I see what you mean. You have to build the infrastructure and found the city ON THE SAME TURN to make it work. Is that right? If that works... I change my mind. I didn't understand fully the first time. That is a bug and a bug exploit. It should be banned from future challenge games, and generally banned from organized multiplay, in my opinion.

but i said that right in the beginning.
why do you think it should be banned then ?

[quinns]

I know you said it the first time, Math. My fault, I missed it the first time I read it.

I think this build-city-on-infrastructure bug should be banned because it falls into the same category as rush-buy-switch trick. It obviously is a "bug" and all bug exploits are banned in organized ctp play. This is a bug exploit. No fault on you for using it earlier, Math. Thanks for pointing this out! My vote is for banning use.

[Mathemagician]

okay, i wont use it in my PBEM (or MP) games for now. (hope i dont forget it though cause im really used to it now)
but i really want a quick definite decision by the whole community...