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Commitee of Strategic Planning

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  • Commitee of Strategic Planning

    Introduction

    Recently we've been discussing things regarding long-term development in different threads, starting from turn tracking threads to diplomacy threads.

    I have a feeling that those threads should better be kept for their specific discussions (in turn tracking thread - discussions regarding orders in that turn, in diplomacy thread - discussions regarding diplomacy).
    I agree that the line distinguishing things is quite unclear, but it would be better that e.g. in diplomacy thread we'd already be knowing what our goals are and would just compile the messages and discuss responses keeping in mind what's been discussed here.


    All information in this thread should be kept inside our private forum.

    Everything here is subject to discussion and changes as discussed.




    So to get closer to job needing to be done:



    Our mission
    It has been expressed multiple times that our ultimate goal should be space race victory.
    Of course other victory types are possible too, but Im afraid that being Industrious and Financial there's no better choice of victory type than Space Race as it requires exactly the things we have the best - research and wonder building.



    Our mid-term goals:
    Keeping the mission of space race in mind we should be considering following imperatives:

    1.Outresearch other teams.
    2.Defend our homeland until we've built the spaceship.
    3.Outbuild other teams if outresearch is not as successful as expected.


    Tactics used to achieve mid-term goals:
    1.Outresearch:

    1.1. Financial gives us quite and advantage, to use this advantage to max, we should be focusing our improvement building on achieving 2g base for most squares (which automatically translates to 3g as per our bonus). We can achieve this goal by extensive use of:
    - cottages
    - sea squares
    - windmills

    We are already planning an emphasize on sea square commerce by adding Colossus to them, we should also be considering technologies and civics which give cottages and windmills additional output, of increased value.
    Windmills will be available upon researching Machinery.

    1.2. Being a coastal civ, emphasis on commerce is and option that shouldn't be ignored. For that matter we are considering investment in Great Lighthouse and later, trade route count increasing techs and civics are also appealing (closest in reach being currency, which should be one of our top techs after we get alphabet and compass, which comes after iron working).

    1.3. Great People are an option in using them either as an instant tech source or added to city. However, they are most usefull if 'grown' (and added) to one special city - the Super Science City. Currently our capital seems quite appropriate for being SCC.


    2. Defense.
    Being situated on a continent along with one other civ, it is only natural that, in order to become safe from intrusions of external enemies on the way to victory, we need to achieve complete domination of this continent.
    It will be much easier to defend ourselves when the only border we have is a naval one (especially if we've been focusing on naval discoveries as the former imperative implies).
    To achieve such domination following strategies would be applicable:

    2.1. Chu-ko-nu rush enabled to us by recent pop of Metal Casting. This option is the closest to our current situation and seems very promising as a surprise attack.
    This can be followed up by War Elephants / Catapults if the war drags on.

    2.2. Combined Knights / Macemen / Catapult strike once we've achieved the needed technologies
    This option is much more risky, because more advanced defense options are available to enemy by this time - Longbows, Pikemen and because if war drags on, Bananas could be getting to gunpowder, which could easily translate into our defeat knowing their UU.

    2.3. Late game strike (from Riflemen/Cavalry/Grenadiers up to Artillery / Infatry / Tanks / Aircraft), which is not likely to be as favourable to us, unless we've got a good tech lead. It's also much more possible to bring in reinforcements from other continents that late as of advanced navy options.


    3.Outbuild.

    3.1. Resources are crucial if we are to outbuild the other civs towards space race, which indirectly implies aggressive action in securing domination on our continent to increase our chances to get such a crucial resource as aluminium.

    3.2. A heavy-duty production city could be very beneficial here, especially if we have Ironworks there and iron and/or coal.


    If we've come this far we won't be able to rely on such factors as technological superiority (after all lack of it will be why we've come here) and it's granted production bonuses (factories, power plants), neither we will be able to squeeze much out of GP farming, as there are some much better GP-pumping civs around.



    [under construction]


    Discuss
    -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
    -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

  • #2
    [reserved]
    -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
    -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

    Comment


    • #3
      I think you underestimate the need for high production cities. One high production city really isn't going to satisfy all our needs. I think we need four at the least. Two for military production and two for wonder production.

      Considering that we are obviously destined to be the number one faction scorewise and that we'll have a cottage spamming terraforming, we'll be a prime target for pillaging attempts and counteralliances to prevent us winning (especially if we're gonna space race). Thus we'll always need a strong military to persuade people not to attack us. Besides, there are three military national wonders, so if we want to make the best use of those, we need two military cities anyway.

      Two wonder cities would also be nice. There might be times when our prime wonder city is already busy building a wonder or building some crucial building, so a second high production city would be useful, so we don't waste time to start wonder production. In a competitive environment even a small delay could mean losing the wonder to someone else.
      Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
      Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm not sure we'd need 2 wonder cities unless theres some overlap between military production/wonder production/capital and great person farm. (I find a city can often be several of these)

        Sugggestion: We get a galley out to sea early and meet people. We try and make one good ally suitably far away from us with whom we trade tech and encourage them to dominate their own continent. Everyone else will then have more difficulty invading either of us without the other doing raids on their coastal cities.

        Also, we should put an axeman on this galley if possible. Just in case we come across someone guarding a wonder city with a warrior.

        Comment


        • #5
          I think you underestimate the need for high production cities. One high production city really isn't going to satisfy all our needs. I think we need four at the least. Two for military production and two for wonder production.
          Okay.

          One of the wonder cities should be Beijing, which should also become the GP farm and SCC seeing how it's in a terrain pretty well suited.


          RNG_temple will make a good military city.

          If we hook up iron that city is gonna be high on hammers aswell, so that might be the second mil city.

          Shold be enough I think as the wonder-city roles could be temporarily executed by any of the mil cities - we won't be continuously pumping units after all (I hope ).
          -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
          -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

          Comment


          • #6
            No, we'll need at least 3 high-production cities. And one of them should be on the coast. (preferably two)

            When we secure our Island, we should be able to churn out ships like there's no tomorrow, to at least establish a sentry net to spot invasions.
            Indifference is Bliss

            Comment


            • #7
              Beijing
              RNG_Temple

              are already pretty good.

              The prospective Iron site city should also be good.

              But I see your point - maybe we should take a look at the map once again to check where a high production city is possible.
              IIRC the horses were close to seaside and not far from marble, so that could make a good prod city aswell.
              -- What history has taught us is that people do not learn from history.
              -- Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

              Comment


              • #8
                So all our other cities will be terraformed for high commerce to get us closer to the space race victory?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Senethro
                  I'm not sure we'd need 2 wonder cities unless theres some overlap between military production/wonder production/capital and great person farm. (I find a city can often be several of these)
                  Originally posted by binTravkin
                  One of the wonder cities should be Beijing, which should also become the GP farm and SCC seeing how it's in a terrain pretty well suited.
                  It's certainly possible for a city to be pretty good at more than one thing. However due to that damned limit of two national wonders per city, it simply isn't possible to excel at more than one thing.

                  Eg for making the best use of Beijing as a GP farm and SCC we should need four national wonders there: National Epic, Globe Theatre, Oxford University, Wall Street. Assuming we'll be running Bureaucracy for a while, it would also be neat to have the Heroic Epic there to stack the production bonus. Unfortunately this isn't all possible. We simply HAVE to make choices - specialize our best cities. It would be preferable if we know in advance where we want our

                  high food city
                  Globe Theatre (no unhappiness)
                  National Epic (+100% GP)

                  high commerce city
                  Wall Street (+100% gold - synergy with religion founding city, but I guess we might not have one)
                  Oxford University (+100% science)

                  high production cities
                  Iron Works (best in a wonder city and not a military city - this together with Heroic Epic is overkill in my experience)
                  Red Cross (free medic promotion)
                  Heroic Epic (+100% military production)
                  West Point (+2 XP)
                  Palace (+50% production and commerce if running bureaucracy - doesn't count to national wonder limit)

                  these can be built anywhere, but best in a productive city if we don't want it to take ages
                  Scotland Yard
                  Mt. Rushmore

                  situational
                  Hermitage
                  Forbidden Palace
                  Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
                  Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    West point adds +4 XP to units built in that city.


                    I usually stack West Point with the Heroic Epic, preferably on a coastal city with lots of hills and a couple of sea resources.

                    Iron works should go on one of our wonder cities.

                    We might also want to segregate GP points... Try and get all the engineer points on the same city, and try to get all scientific points on another... These (with merchants as a close third) will be our most important GP's IMHO.

                    Also, I do not agree with building Oxford's Uni and Wall Street on the same city. Specialists also enter in this bonus, so we should build Oxford in a high commerce, high food city (will probably need a great engineer to do this though) and then put up scientists with the extra food.
                    A mostly grass city, with maybe a river and a food special (could be a coast city with some seafood) would be ideal for this.

                    Wall street is better in a city with a religious shrine, especially if we plan to keep our science high as much as possible.
                    Indifference is Bliss

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      That reminds me, whats happened with all the religions?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I don't think we'll have much luck collecting Great Engineer points - our only likely source for a while is the one engineer specialist per forge. We might as well just try to get as many engineer points across our empire as reasonable, and hope we get a decent number of GEs out of the GPs we get.
                        "Cutlery confused Stalin"
                        -BBC news

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          We could try and nab the pyramida with our first GE...
                          Indifference is Bliss

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by N35t0r
                            We could try and nab the pyramida with our first GE...
                            QFT!
                            Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
                            Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Senethro
                              That reminds me, whats happened with all the religions?
                              With luck, the bananas will found one on their capital and build a shrine just before we capture it

                              In fact, we might want to heavily suggest this...
                              Indifference is Bliss

                              Comment

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