Banana Embassy

[Maniac]

I PMed snoopy. I suspect too they might just make it up. Would be really silly though, as it can be easily checked.

[snoopy369]

This was discussed back at the beginning of the game, six months ago or so. Teams may not share contact with a third team until contact is made in game.

However, map trading is permitted with no restrictions, so this is rather easily worked around.

[binTravkin]

Teams may not share contact with a third team until contact is made in game.

And how does 'sharing contact' relates to 'telling about the strange people's we met'?

The only implication this rule can make here is that Bananas may not be an intermediate in talks between us and the third team, other than that, they're allowed to say about them (form their 3rd person perspective) anything they want, e.g. 'those people are strange, they worship some kind of ethereal being called "The Storm", heretics!'

[Lacero]

top three points: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...hreadid=153565

Teams should not discuss their relations with a third team that has not contacted one of the teams. May teams discuss having contact with a third team but not mention the team's name?

I'm not entirely sure why it's a rule, but it seems like it is. The bit in italics hasn't been agreed on yet afaik.

But then we don't want to discuss the banana's relationship with this team, all we really need to do is to get the bananas to pass on a message like: "sit your unit on top of a hill and wait".

oh, and failing that we can just get them to give us a new map and find the other teams scout ourselves.

[snoopy369]

Passing on a message is precisely what's definitely prohibited. In fact, even with a map you wouldn't be permitted to talk to them via banana... that's actual contact, and is NOT permitted until in-game contact is made.

Unfortunately that thread you reference devolved into discussions of other things and nobody really discussed the above point. As such, I've maintained it as a rule when asked. Like I said, it's trivial to get a map ...

bt, that was what I was trying to get out of that discussion, which didn't go anywhere for whatever reason ... I tended to assume in those discussions (as a group) that things people didn't post about, weren't important one way or the other, and I could go with my gut. I'm not sure I'd still rule this way in future games (if there were still no group decision made), but I've ruled this way for this game with other teams, so I'm not going to change at this point.

[Lacero]

It seems to me you've banned us discussing how to treat the new civ, but not banned passing on messages. If you keep this rule in future I suggest you rewrite it, people may have agreed with the text but to me it doesn't mean what you're enforcing.

But yeah if it's been ruled like this already it can't change, we should ask for a map.

[snoopy369]

Passing on messages is in the not-written-obvious rules of DG, so I didn't write it down ... my bad...

You cannot discuss THAT THERE IS a new civ. Banana technically shouldn't have told you there was another civ in the first place. I'd say, that this prevents passing on messages (since you aren't supposed to know about the third civ, you can't send them messages) ...

Anyway, in the future were I to mod another demogame I probably won't suggest such things, and hopefully others will object to silly statements of mine such as this

[binTravkin]

However, map trading is permitted with no restrictions, so this is rather easily worked around.

By getting a map we'd know who they are (the other civ), so maybe we should try and obtain one..

[binTravkin]

A list things that should be in our next message (just so we dont forget any):

- information about our decision to go writing (if they remove Wwriting from the deal and we AH, that actually makes the deal more profitable to them and it should be mentioned, so that they're not so embittered).

- proposal to share iron ore locations
- claim of that city location (#5 in the proposal I drew)

It could be good that their benefits:
- 30beaker discount in tech deal
- knowledge of iron ore sites

go against our
- claim of wheat and iron on that side of formal demarcation line - river

Maybe we can even request a screenie of the other civ they met in return?
We could then advance our scout to meet them ourselves..

[Impaler[WrG]]

Heres a draft proposal covering the sugjested points. If theirs no objection over the next day or two I'll send it on its way. (with some spell checking too)

****************************************

Most Jubilant Greetings Honored Banana Diplomate, I Impaler[WrG] once again have the pleasure of bringing many good tidings to your ears.

First let me direct your atention to this scroll (see atatchment) our metalurgest have succeded in forging Iron and the locations of several Iron lodes have been identified. The land is rich with 3 sources alredy identified, of these one is to our west, one to your east and one between us on the edge of the arctic wastes. It is on this point we wish to make a further proposal.

As we agreed so many years ago the people of Yang have claim to mine the Marble of this land and the people of Banana shall in exchange recive supplies of said marble upon request and without charge once it becomes possible. Our glorious Chairman has resently completed a plan for the founding of future cities. With the discover of this Iron site nearby the Marble the most obvious location is a City is one located on the small hill overlooking the marble quarries and Iron mines. But due to the desolate nature of the area the city would be dependent opon the wheat field to the south for sustinance. Theirfor we seek an agreement that the area of this future city be formaly declared territory of the One Yang and that no future Banana City be placed in such a way as to have overlap with it. If this would result in your People being deprived of wheat we will agree to gift a wheat to you as their is another in the west we can use. Shurly this request is not unreasonable considering our earlier agrements, the marginal nature of the lands in question and our limited room for expantion.

Now for my next topic, our Scolars have now directed their efforts towards Writing. They belive that the creation of a Library though taking some considerable investment in resorces will ultimatly return our investment in about a generation. Thus by the time we are ready to exchange knowlage we expect to have the promissed technologies but with Writing and Animal Husbandry now droped from the exchange the balance of points would now be in your favor by a slight margin. We plan to follow with Fishing, Sailing and Masonry for a chance at the Great Lighthouse. How do your plans progress and how soon do you think Alphabet will be ready as we are eager to exchange Techs?

Lastly the issue of the new-comers to our land, our scouts are now penetrating into the area to your south, late last night news reached me that a scouting party of the long sought 3rd tribe made contact with ours. Their language was atfirst strange and indesipherable to us but after many gestures they were able to identify themselves by the some-what ominus name of Gathering Storm. I will soon be ocupied in a formal greeting ceremony afterwards we can begin planning a three way meeting probably over IRC. On behalf of the One Yang and all his children I thank your people for making this contact possible.

And now once again I depart from your presense Honored Bananaian Diplomate, Signed Impaler[WrG] humble servant of the One Yang.

[binTravkin]

It's good, but in the paragraph where we claim the tundra site we should also mention that all in all the site is not so good as of being a cold place, and is mostly planned to hook up those important resources (marble and iron), so we hope that the Bananas had no plans for that deserted place themselves.
Also, we should, on a more apologetic fashion, say that we hope Bananas see this claim as fair, knowing that there's little good land on this side of river, while the Bananas can still expand south, where, as their screenie showed, there are plenty of good resources to claim.

Also, in the clause about alphabet, we should say that we're eager to exchange techs as soon as possible as we expect our nations both usher into new era of greatness by cooperating our research (and gain an edge vs others )

[Impaler[WrG]]

Edited/Sent with sugjestions and 3rd paragraph changed to inform them of our contact with GS (which they probably already heard about from GS anyhow) mainly I wanted to thank them for making it possible and start the ball rolling on a 3-way

[binTravkin]

Been a whole six days until you sent this.
Wonder what the Bananas are doing..

[N35t0r]

Working on their epitaph?

[Maniac]

I as Banana would be pissed off after reading AC started researching Writing.

Have we actually signed an agreement yet btw?