Diplomacy Thread

[jdjdjd]

Ok - things have moved along since my last post....

Our Great Leader would like your thoughts on this offer from Trip of Lux Invicta:

Lastly, my team offers a deal for us to move our warrior exploring to the south, and you to move your warrior exploring north to other lands, so that we may spare them for other pursuits... When the ability becomes available, we will trade maps with each other, which will save us both much time and allow us to use our scouts in more fruitful matters.

we concentrate on southern points and they on northern, and then trade maps...

what do you all think?

[Thud]

I think this is a good idea. If we were playing against an AI, I wouldn't go for it, but then if we were playing against the AI we wouldn't be able to even make that deal. I think that any disadvantages inherent in trading maps with the AI are eliminated with the ability to deal with your opponents outside of the game. There are some advantages I would associate with it as well.

Humans will be inherently more trustworthy than computers in this game... if only because it won't be cheap to get someone to sign a military alliance when war breaks out.

[GodKing]

hmmmmmmmm

I am not sure...... this is a major item that I feel we shoud have a vote on when the time comes. Remember, once they have ours, they can trade it with everybody. This amounts to a major tactical advantage. I have no objection to an even steven trade, but how do we prevent them from trading our info with other civs?

[mrmitchell]

Thanks for all the feedback on the map. As far as the GoW relation to us, the red line was a thin line, meaning utter hatred could possibly happen. I'm sorry if you couldn't differentiate between the lines, but Paint only has 5 line sizes and apparently the first 2 are too small.

"Well go get Photoshop or something that'll let you do it!"

1) I am too cheapskate to buy it; 2) I am too lazy/impatient to d/l a warez.

While we could possibly be in cahoots with GoW, it's less chance than a cahoots-ship with LI and I figured that the situation wasn't going to get any better, so we'd might as well assume the worst. Plus, LI wants to keep GoW penned in, so cahooting with both of them (I'm creating all sorts of variations on "cahoots" here) would result in us having to choose one or the other to cahoot with soon. Since there's already some idea that we might forge out a cahoots with Lux, I decided to go with that.

As per adaMada's post about Neu, we don't need to look like filthy backstabbers, which is how we're going to look like either way if we try to push a stake in matters any deeper. So I suggest an isolationist policy until one of the GoW-LI-ND love triangle is eliminated.

[mrmitchell]

As per moving our Warrior south and theirs north, remember, we need to make sure they aren't trying to trick us. Spirits know, they might even be trying to hide something of importance up there from us, and there's no obligation in the game to trade the map. It's just a collection of 0s and 1s. (However, if the evilness begins this early, it's pretty obvious we are all dead meat, including all the other teams.)

Come to think of it, we don't need to be so isolationist as much as we need to be neutral. We can still trade, and try to push our own influence into the northern lands, but allying will only hurt until one of them is gone. The unique situation that adaMada speculated about, as much as I hate to say it, will probably not happen and, once again, even if it did, would make us look like bloody backstabbers if we took action on it. The trades: good idea. Alliance: bad idea. I'd rather we not look like evil bloody backstabbing @$$holes. We really needn't even be showing a lean towards LI, but it seems the other teams aren't even in the know about anything, so if we just quietly go away LI will think of us as friends and ND, GoW won't know any better. (Of course, I dunno, so I dunno.)

[Togas]

Trip is a clever chap, but I think he's met his match. He invited me to chat today and we talked for about 40 minutes. He'd been corresponding with jdjdjd for a while, but I think he wanted to see he he could get a better deal from me.

They wanted to offer us W.C., Wheel, and Iron Working for Alphabet & Writing, which wasn't entirely a bad deal, but after a short discusion about the values of the techs (or lack of value to us), etc, he is considering trading IW for Alph + 25g.

He wanted me to agree to a Mil. Alliance, but I postponed it, gave it alot of positive support and told him to send it to Jdjdjd to "work out the details."

Note: I did tell him that IF we made an alliance is should be secret, as I didn't want to give ND & GoW a reason to start working together, I wanted to keep them apart. Trip loved this idea and made a comment about how had an idea how to keep them apart.

He wants to agree to future tech deals -- Horseback for Writing, Mysticism for Mapmaking. I told him that we're not keen on Horseback, but we'll think about the deal in the future. We'll see. Depends on how things go.... etc.

I fully intend to get Horseback from either GoW or Lux. We'll see who has the better offer, and then tell the other team we don't need the deadend tech because we can't use it in our jungle.

Lastly, I did agree with him to have our warrior withdraw to south of the jungle AFTER we meet the GoW warrior. They agreed to have their warrior immediately withdraw. Once we meet GoW, we should explore the northern border of the jungle to get a better idea of where the "neutral zone" ends.

Furthermore, we agreed to trade maps once we research mapmaking. As a part of that FORMAL agreement (Jdjdjd will formalize), we should state that our maps should not be traded to other teams (for certain period of time?)

--Togas

[Thud]

An agreement that our maps shall not be traded not only eliminates GKs problem, but holds a hidden blessing, as it will significantly cement our relationship.

I may support an alliance with lux, but I think we should stall for time on that particular issue and see how things develop.

[Arnelos]

[OOC]

Togas,

I REALLY like that negotiation you did with Trip.

That said, we need to ensure that WE are not the ones being "played"

[mrmitchell]

How is it that we are going to trade maps? Are we going to trade in-game, or are we going to trade GIFs or JPGs that can easily be edited?

As far as the military alliance goes, while I still think that complete neutrality would be a better idea until one of the triangle nations is eliminated, we should at least keep it secret. Great idea, Grand Despot Togas.

[mrmitchell]

Alarming discovery!!!

I'm sure you all probably have seen this, but according to the mysterious "F11" report we are 6th in the world on military service.

I don't know if more factors than sheer units go into the calculation of this, but this can't be good.

This means only one nation could be behind us in military (probably Legoland.)

What else does this mean? We're behind, at a minimum, 2 of the 3 triangle nations. That's not good. I'm hoping LI is the strongest one and they won't try to backstab us, because we need the help militarily, if I'm thinking right here.

Just wanted to let you know of this...

(BTW, as much a peace-loving hippie as I am, I suggest a serious increase in our armed forces.)

Also, Lux Invicta's Imperial City capital is down to 1 population...which suggests they are 1) built a settler recently or 2) pumping out workers. I'm pretty sure it would be 1) .

Just some information from the "F11 Report"

(Also, considering Lego's speedy growth, they have probably already built their 2nd city too despite being at 2 population.)

[Nuclear Winter]

To discuss diplomatic matters[as well as other controverse matters] let all of us online gather at the oaken table ( #civ3rp Migros )

For the light of the despot!!!

[adaMada]

Message from GoW

It seems like our warriors are very close together now, but our previous tech deal is obselete; therefore I would like to get a new meeting deal together with you. It might be good to tell each other what we have, so we can see what can be traded - therefore

The GoW has these techs:
-masonry
-Pottery
-wheel
-warrior code
-bronze working
-ceremonial burial

what does roleplay have?

What should I respond with? Assuming that I'm to respond in kind (and our tech list is no secret), can someone give me an updated tech list -- I don't want to miss any, and I don't have access to PTW...

GoW's gotten into the rather bad habit of trading for whatever tech we've agreed to give to them in a deal (Bronze Working this time) . Considering that we've gone to great lengths not to aquire a technology that we had lined up from them, I'm hesitant to offer another deal for them, but they may have something we can use.

Any thoughts?

-- adaMada

[Nuclear Winter]

Go to the mIRc, adamada, go to the mIRC

[adaMada]

Don't have mIRC on this computer, but I'll see if java chat works.

-- adaMada

EDIT: Java chat works.

[Togas]

I'm going to personally write Ghengis Farb to tell him how frustrated I am at his team for trading when we had a deal, especially when we turned down Lux.

If they don't give us a very favorable offer, I propose we don't sell them Alphabet. Sure, they can get it from ND, but we need to make a point that we're not going to accept being stood up like this.

We may have to get Warrior Code from ND or Lux, but let's wait to see how GoW responds to our being insulted.

Will post his response.

--Togas