Israel civ

[joncnunn]

My money would be on Isreal even if Egypt, Jordon, Syria, Iraq, and Libya all declared war against Isreal in the near future and the US stayed out.

And if the war lasts more than 3 weeks, the Isreali army would probably be aproaching both Egypt's and Syria's capitals.

Didn't know that French had more nukes than the British. I dought the French would have done anything if some terriorsts had flown French commerical aircraft into their national landmark so I'm not sure why the French govt has so many nukes.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Eli

They aren't even in the top five mate. I agree that the Israelis have an excellent military - in fact I would say that they are arguably the best; but there just aren't enough of them to withstand a real superpower. Do you honestly think that the IDF could whip full might of the United States military machine, or the Russians, or the Chinese, or even the British or the French? You're kidding, right?

In 1973 the number of soldiers, tanks and other military equipment directed against Israel was the size of the entire NATO military in Western Europe.

The soldiers were Arabs though, so there were serious quality wise differences.

Also, dont forget that Israel's nuclear arsenal is bigger than the British one and close to the French.

I don't know how many nuclear weapons Israel has but I would be surprised if an accurate figure was available to the public.

I don't see what all this has to do with the game anyway.

And

Ariel Sharon is indisputably a fatty - just look at him.

[Az]

errm, I don't mind that, I mind the Hitler comparison.

[sabrewolf]

i think this comparison is way too hard, but... well, A.S. is not doing much to prove the opposite either - sorry.

however, a politician shouldn't be judged by his looks (whether sharon weighs 60, 100 or 200 kg doesn't matter the slightest bit). it's the things politicians DO which count.

gorbatchov had his big birthmark on his head, napoleon was very small, churchill smoked lethal cigars, helmut kohl was 1.90m (6"3) tall and weighed approx. 130 kg (~285 pounds), a female adviser of blair was nearly bold, etc. etc. etc. --> nothing really matters, as long as they do their job and they do it well...

[edit: corrections]

[Panag]

Originally posted by Eli

They aren't even in the top five mate. I agree that the Israelis have an excellent military - in fact I would say that they are arguably the best; but there just aren't enough of them to withstand a real superpower. Do you honestly think that the IDF could whip full might of the United States military machine, or the Russians, or the Chinese, or even the British or the French? You're kidding, right?

In 1973 the number of soldiers, tanks and other military equipment directed against Israel was the size of the entire NATO military in Western Europe.

The soldiers were Arabs though, so there were serious quality wise differences.

Also, dont forget that Israel's nuclear arsenal is bigger than the British one and close to the French.

hi ,

ours shall be a bit bigger then the French , they are getting rid of most of the nukes , they only keep a couple for airplanes and the rest is on sub's , they have no longer land based ICBM's and artillery shells , ....

have a nice day

[Panag]

Originally posted by Agathon


I don't know how many nuclear weapons Israel has but I would be surprised if an accurate figure was available to the public.

I don't see what all this has to do with the game anyway.

And

Ariel Sharon is indisputably a fatty - just look at him.

hi ,

and what has the clothing size of Ariel Sharon to do with the game , .......

have a nice day

[Panag]

Originally posted by XarXo
Sharon is a fatty older version of Hitler. He is not hebrew, is just another assassin. Sorry if somebody dislike my opinion.

BTW: Arafat is not quite different of Sharon...

and what the heck has this to do with the civ3 game , and you are completely wrong , ......

you can give your opinion's some where else

[Panag]

Originally posted by sabrewolf
i think this comparison is way too hard, but... well, A.S. is not doing much to prove the opposite either - sorry.

however, a politician shouldn't be judged by his looks (whether sharon weighs 60, 100 or 200 kg doesn't matter the slightest bit). it's the things politicians DO which count.

gorbatchov had his big birthmark on his head, napoleon was very small, churchill smoked lethal cigars, helmut kohl was 1.90m (6"3) tall and weighed approx. 130 kg (~285 pounds), a female adviser of blair was nearly bold, etc. etc. etc. --> nothing really matters, as long as they do their job and they do it well...

[edit: corrections]

hi ,

well how shall we look when we reach that age , ......

in his young days he was looking not to bad , .....

, to get this thread back on topic ; what leaderhead should be used , ......

have a nice day

[Yahweh Sabaoth]

Re: Top five militaries vs. Israel

Well, doubtless Israel couldn't deal with an American invasion, but look at Russia! That can't even keep Chechnya in line. Israel is rated #1 in efficiency, but size-wise, the IDF is quite small, so no, no global conquests for Israel... but no conquest OF Israel anytime soon that I could imagine.

[XarXo]

Israel in Civ 3 is like including Gypsies (as I said a couple of times before), just they are rich.

They never formed a big country, if they should be in Civ 3 is quite a bad reason. I preffer Thai-Siamese for example.

Their remarkable cultural apportation is only based in the bible. They are not christians, so including Romans in the game was a better choice (they expanded the religion after 313 aC and they are the base of the first "saints" and christian mythology). This book is great, yes, but the roman laws, the ramayana-mahabarata, the coran (yes, i'm not crazy) and a lot of other codes are great too.

-------- OUT of Civ3 --------

panag, you MUST recognize that "CONTROLLED TERRORISM ELIMINATION" is a nonsense of killings. Sharon know something about "prisons" and their use?

What about the Cisjordania and Gaza territories? They NEVER where included in the original british colony, in fact, they are "gifts" from Jordania and Egypt to palestinians.

Finally, palestinians (as appeared in this thread) in a looong past where philistines, descendants of the canaanites, and THEY stayed here before than hebrews (oh yes, God intervention... I forgot it ).

If your country is a small, desertic, poor piece of the world, sorry man, there are a lot of countries in a worse situation (but remember! THAT is a God gift Woah!).

[Panag]

Originally posted by XarXo
Israel in Civ 3 is like including Gypsies (as I said a couple of times before), just they are rich.

They never formed a big country, if they should be in Civ 3 is quite a bad reason. I preffer Thai-Siamese for example.

Their remarkable cultural apportation is only based in the bible. They are not christians, so including Romans in the game was a better choice (they expanded the religion after 313 aC and they are the base of the first "saints" and christian mythology). This book is great, yes, but the roman laws, the ramayana-mahabarata, the coran (yes, i'm not crazy) and a lot of other codes are great too.

-------- OUT of Civ3 --------

panag, you MUST recognize that "CONTROLLED TERRORISM ELIMINATION" is a nonsense of killings. Sharon know something about "prisons" and their use?

What about the Cisjordania and Gaza territories? They NEVER where included in the original british colony, in fact, they are "gifts" from Jordania and Egypt to palestinians.

Finally, palestinians (as appeared in this thread) in a looong past where philistines, descendants of the canaanites, and THEY stayed here before than hebrews (oh yes, God intervention... I forgot it ).

If your country is a small, desertic, poor piece of the world, sorry man, there are a lot of countries in a worse situation (but remember! THAT is a God gift Woah!).

hi ,

look man , can you keep your BS in the off topic threads on this site and NOT in a game thread , ......

and you seem to be only getting your information from one side , .....

so keep the OT in the OT

have a nice day

[Ming]

Gee... I'm actually agreeing with panag on this one

If you want to talk politics, do it in the OTF. This thread is about Civ... Not what's happening now in real life...

[Az]

Finally, palestinians (as appeared in this thread) in a looong past where philistines, descendants of the canaanites, and THEY stayed here before than hebrews

ermmm, where? at it's own time, the Hebrew kingdom was the only canaanite kingdom remaining. The Phoenicians were long gone at the start of the christian era. the Edomites were integrated into the hebrew kingdom. The first arabs to rule a piece of this land were the Nabateans, that ruled southern Jordan (edom) and the Negev. many of the arabs that are in this land today are not of arabic descent, but since they choose to call themselves arabs, I would call them that way, just as the christian 'arabs' that live next door, are perhaps the greatgrandchildren of christian migrants, since they look rather european. Ethnicity doesn't define nationality. Just look at the Sudan, and at Iraq, and tell me that they're of the same ethnicity, yet both consider themselves to be 'arab' by nationality.

about the stupid "Israel vs. top 5 militaries of the world" is a stupid debate, Since no smart country would dare to invade another country with nukes. the US would be able to conquer Israel, but it would loose a couple of it's most important cities. So would any other nation on earth, since Israel has nukes and has space launch capability which equals ICBMs.

I've already stated my position on the subject, to include the canaanites as a civ, have both phoenician and ancient Israeli and Canaanite cities,as well as modern Israeli cities. I am sure that the combined richness of both of these civilizations would make it worthwhile to include in Civ4: Play-with-yourself.

[Yahweh Sabaoth]

Originally posted by Azazel

ermmm, where? at it's own time, the Hebrew kingdom was the only canaanite kingdom remaining. The Phoenicians were long gone at the start of the christian era. the Edomites were integrated into the hebrew kingdom. The first arabs to rule a piece of this land were the Nabateans, that ruled southern Jordan (edom) and the Negev. many of the arabs that are in this land today are not of arabic descent, but since they choose to call themselves arabs, I would call them that way, just as the christian 'arabs' that live next door, are perhaps the greatgrandchildren of christian migrants, since they look rather european. Ethnicity doesn't define nationality. Just look at the Sudan, and at Iraq, and tell me that they're of the same ethnicity, yet both consider themselves to be 'arab' by nationality.

about the stupid "Israel vs. top 5 militaries of the world" is a stupid debate, Since no smart country would dare to invade another country with nukes. the US would be able to conquer Israel, but it would loose a couple of it's most important cities. So would any other nation on earth, since Israel has nukes and has space launch capability which equals ICBMs.

I've already stated my position on the subject, to include the canaanites as a civ, have both phoenician and ancient Israeli and Canaanite cities,as well as modern Israeli cities. I am sure that the combined richness of both of these civilizations would make it worthwhile to include in Civ4: Play-with-yourself.

FINALLY someone with an informed opinion!

And one other thing... Israel is worth including because of the Roman-Jewish conflict ALONE. Why else include the Carthaginians, Zulus, Aztecs? Sure, they had empires. So did about 100 other groups/cities/nations you could name. They are there to add DRAMA to the game. If you don't want history in Civ, play a more detailed war-game! (imo)

[Az]

The Jewish-Roman conflict was a relatively large one, and judea was a well-known province, for it's rebel spirit, But the civ game demands a civilization or a family of civilizations that existed for thousands of years ( Or is the US ). Just as the times there were a united India, or China were numbered, and just as the babylonian civ actually represents all of the Two-river civilizations, I propose a canaanite civ that would encompass the canaanites, the Hebrews, and the phoenicians, as well as their children, the Carthaginians and the Israelis of the modern age. I propose their strengths to be religious, for the hebrews' advances in theological and thus, phylosophical thinking, and commercial to represent the carthaginians' and their ancestors, the phoenicians' strength in commerce. Their leader could be Hebrew or could be carthaginian, these are all details. But they deserve a place in civ. (as many more civs do, btw. )