REAL HEROES NAMES for each civ (please participate in this project)

[Bautou]

Babylonians:
Sargon

Perhaps some of these guys:

Ensha.gkushanna (the period is just to stop the auto-censor ): Earliest known Babylonian ruler, conquered Kish and ruled over southern Babylonia.

Eannatum: Conquered and enslaved Gishban, and brought in large amounts of spoils

Naram-Sin: Sargon's son, invaded the Sinai and Cyprus, extending his father's conquests even further

Chedorlaomer- Conquered everything between Babylon and Palestine

Nabuchodonosor- Defeated the Lulubi, Elam, and conquered portions of Syria

Gudea- Conquered Ansham

Zaggisi- Plundered and conquered his way from the Persian Gulf to Mediterrean


As an aside, I don't think that Arbogast is the best choice for a Roman hero. In Roman sources contemporary with him, he is almost invariably refered to as a foreigner and his power was generally resented. Probably a better choice could be one of the following: Germanicus: subdued the Rhineland and conquered Germany to the Elbe. Sulla: won a brutal civil war and became one of the first important Roman dictators. Pompey (or Lucullus)-conquered much the East for Rome

[Taxidopolis]

Originally posted by Kickasso
Ok, Manstein I replace first British hero to Boudicea even despite her legendary origin. I suppose she was a real person of Celts history

Just to reassure you that Boudicea was a real person. Queen of the Iceni tribe she united a pan-tribal revolt against the Roman occupation in AD 60/61 after she and her relatives were brutalised by the Romans. Tacitus records her and the exploits of she and her followers are also recorded. The trail of destruction she left behind is visible today in the archaeological record, modern day Colchester in England was where they started...it was the local capital which they completely sacked before heading and reaching London to have an equally vengeful time there. The rebellion came within an inch of Roman withdrawal from the province.

The preferred spelling is actually Boudica btw. Whoops, that should have been one c in Boudica, hence the edit...must have been shaking after being trashed by Shaka when I posted ;-)

[Dry]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
Godefroi de Bouillon is an excellent choice! Is the spelling correct (are there native French around?).

I am.
Godefroi or Godefroid can be written both way.
I think Godefroid is the spelling of today, while Godefroi is the spelling of Middle-Age.
The name comes in fact comes from Dutch: God Vriend meaning God's friend.

edit: I am not French, but french is my first language.

[Rosacrux]

What about Clovis?

I think Vercicendorix is not a good choice for Franks... He is just a poor Gaul after all

Why not Clovis, he was the first Frank leader, the first King, had some prominent military feats to speak for himself and generally should be a good leader choice.

Thoughts?

[Kickasso]

Thanks a lot, Bautou for short Babylonian history review!

Thus Base Babylonian Heroes List is:
1. Ensha Gkushanna
2. Eannatum
3. Sargon
4. Naram-Sin:
5. Chedorlaomer
6. Nabuchodonosor (not well-victorious from Bible thougth)
7. Gudea
8. Zaggisi

No persons from moderm ages due to early twilight of civ life...

Vercicendorix - is a hard decision according to much criticism here...What I personally think of him? I think he's much more famous than others despite non-french origin...If nobody mind I will leave him. If you insist - Clovis will be a replacement.

Iroquios...where are you?...
Japanese...

N.B. Romans...
Roman Heroes List:
1. Claudius
2. Trajan
3. Attilius Regulus
4. Octavian
5. Scipio Africanus
6. Diocletian
7. Arbogast OR Pompey OR ...
8. Constantine


We are closer to the end. Soon I post complete list and our hard work will be completed!

[Plan Austral]

I agree with the list
but i think that Asurbanipal (dont know how to write him in english) must be in the list.

For modern times what do you think of

Saddam Hussein

[TacticalGrace]

Maximus Decimus Meriduis

Playing as the Romans I got a leader called Maximus.

Was this a great Roman leader or are the people at Firaxis a bit keen on "Gladiator"?

[Cossack]

Kickasso,

I see the English still have this guy George Monck, Earl of whatever. Who is he anyway, I've always been interested in English history but I have never heard of Monck before. So I did some general searches on the internet and zippo. So I went to that site that someone suggested and found some info there, but in no way is Monck a great leader, probably a brave soldier and intelligent diplomat but not the winner of any great victory that had long-lasting effects on the British Empire. Therefore I would replace him with one of the other suggested heros.

Nazdaroviye

The English Cossack

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Cossack
Kickasso,

I see the English still have this guy George Monck, Earl of whatever. Who is he anyway, I've always been interested in English history but I have never heard of Monck before. So I did some general searches on the internet and zippo. So I went to that site that someone suggested and found some info there, but in no way is Monck a great leader, probably a brave soldier and intelligent diplomat but not the winner of any great victory that had long-lasting effects on the British Empire. Therefore I would replace him with one of the other suggested heros.

Nazdaroviye

The English Cossack

I have to disagree- he was at Dunbar, which was the battle that broke the power of the Scottish Covenanters- after that, Scottish Protetants were no longer in a position to challenge the English Republic, or the restored monarchy of Charles II and his successors. He was also commander in the Anglo-Dutch Wars, which saw the rise of British naval power, both commercially and militarily, at the expense of the Dutch and the French, thus establishing the basis for the British Overseas Empire. Combine his land victories over the Royalist forces in the English Civil War, with the foundation of the famed Coldstream Guards under Monck, and you have more than just a brave soldier, but an able commander at land and sea, and someone who, like Talleyrand in France, could literally keep his head whilst others were losing theirs.
I felt it was necessary to have someone from the 17th Century, who epitomised the period of the foundation of the British Empire, and who also had a naval as well as land command- thus George Monck fitted the bill.

[Cossack]

Monck isn't even a well known hero for your average Englishman, and as for him being such an able commander here is an extract from the linked article you linked:

George Monck
English soldier and politician. He took part (1625) in the disastrous expedition against Cádiz and fought against the Spanish in the Netherlands. After service in the Bishops' Wars, he was given a command in Ireland and was there when the English civil war began (1642). He returned to England to fight for Charles I, was captured (1644) at Nantwich, and was not released until 1646.

Doesn't appear so able for around at least 20 years and as for subding another Scottish rebellion, who cares? During that period there were numerous Scottish uprisings up to the last one at Culloden and no doubt he subdued did it with the kind of ruthless streak that Cromwell displayed in Ireland.

Let's stick to the real colonial heroes such as Wolfe and Clive of India, whose military successes laid the foundations for England's colonial expansion in North America and India, respectively.

The English Cossack

[Kickasso]

What to do with George Monck?...

I basicly agree to replace him and offer two candidates instead of him to the final list: Boudicca or Montrose ;-)

1. Boudicea
2. Alfred the Great
3. Richard the Lionheart
4. Edward I 'Longshanks'
5. Henry V
6. James Wolfe (or Montrose)
7. Wellington
8. Montgomery

I would like to draw your attention to Iroquious and 1-2 persons for Zulu, Japanese, Babylon and other civs. Please revise the list below again and finalize your ideas of add/replace/wipe/kick anyone

Fanfare!

The final (almost) list of CIV3 civs Heroes:
-----------------

Roman Heroes List:
1. Claudius
2. Trajan
3. Attilius Regulus
4. Octavian
5. Scipio Africanus
6. Diocletian
7. Arbogast OR Pompey OR ...
8. Constantine
------------------

Babylonian Heroes List:
1. Ensha Gkushanna
2. Eannatum
3. Sargon
4. Naram-Sin:
5. Chedorlaomer
6. Nabuchodonosor
7. Gudea
8. Zaggisi
-------------------

Iroquios Heroes List:
1. Tecumseh
2. Red Cloud
3. Black Hawk
4. Sitting Bull
5. Crazy Horse
6. Geronimo
7.8....Manitu, help us your mindless children!
--------------------

Japanese Heroes List:
1. Motonari
2. Nobunaga
3. Katsuie
4. Takeda
5. Tadatsugu
6. Uesugi
7. Yoma****a
8. ...someone from modern ages???
--------------------

France Heroes List:
1. Vercingetorix
2. Philip Augustus
3. Godefroi de Bouillon
4. Raymond St. Gilles
5. Marshal Turenne
6. La Faillette
7. Napoleon
8. De Gaulle
--------------------

Egyptian Heroes List:
1. Na'rmer
2. Weni
3. Mentuhotep II
4. Senusret
5. Kamose
6. Tuthmose
7. Ramses
8. Baybars
--------------------

Chinese Heroes List:
1. Han Xin
2. Sun Bin
3. Sun Tzu
4. Zhang Liang
5. Zhuge Liang
6. Wei Qing
7. Huo Qubing
8. Sima Yi
---------------------

German Heroes List:
1. Hermann the Cherusker
2. Karl Martell
3. Karl the Great
4. Friedrich I 'Barbarossa'
5. Friedrich II the Great
6. Bluecher or Moltke - you vote please
7. Manstein
8. Rommel
---------------------

Persian Heroes List
1. Cyrus the Great
2. Cambyses II
3. Darius the Great
4. Surenas
5. Mithrades
6. Chosroes II
7. Sha Ismail
8. Megabazus
---------------------

Zululand Heroes List:
1. Nehanda
2. Dingane
3. Cetshwayo 'Mpande'
4. Ntshingwayo
5. Nongalaza
6. Dabulamanzi
7. Prince Mbilini
8. is still a question...Help here!
---------------------

Indian Heroes List:
1. Chandragupta Maurya
2. Bindusara
3. Ashoka
4. Shivaji
5. Smadragupta
6. Chandragupta II
7. Porus
8. Tilak
----------------------

Yankee (ok..ok..I'm not going to jeer at Americans at all)
1. Washington
2. Grant
3. Lee
4. Sherman
5. Jackson
6. MacArthur
7. Patton
8. ??? - your ideas (Rivere, Lafaette, Powell )

I personally suggest Sid Meier without any joke - he's really deserve it as my gaughter says. Only prob is his military records but can we make an exclusion for him?


----------------------

Greeks Heroes List:
1. Achilleas
2. Leonidas
3. Pericles
4. Pyrrhos
5. Belisarius
6. Basil Bulgaroctonos
7. Kolokotronis
8. Pavlos Melas
----------------------

Aztec (Mex) Heroes List:
1. Cuauhtemoc
2. Cuitlahuac
3. Moctezuma
4. Tizoc
5. Itzcoatl
6. Huitzilihuitli
7. Benito Juarez
8. General Santa Anna
------------------------

Russian Heroes List:
1. Svyatoslav
2. Alexander Nevsky
3. Dmitry Donskoy
4. Ivan The Terrible
5. Peter The Great
6. Alexander Suvorov
7. Mikhail Kutuzov
8. George Zhukov


P.S. Nice to see your avatars, friends ...

[Cossack]

Kickasso,

I'd go for Boudiccia we need an ancient hero even if it is a Celtic hero. Shame Civ III doesn't have the Celts that would solve the argument.

Cheers

The English Cossack

[Kickasso]

Cossack, I put British Heroes List destiny in your hand - see the most detailed list (by Macaskil) and select one to complete it
-------------
British/Irish Heroes

Since Firaxis includes Wallace in their "English" heroes I suggest we look at all heroes from the British Isles, whether Anglo-Saxon or Celtic.

English

Alfred the Great (held off Danes)
Athelstan (defeated Scots and Vikings)
Edgar Aetheling (threw out the Danes)
Edward I (beat Scots and Welsh)
Hereward the Wake (guerilla fighter against William the Conq)
Henry V (Agincourt)
The Black Prince (Crecy)
Drake (Armada)

British (ie 1603-)

Cromwell (not a hero to the Irish - but see below)
Monk (Civil War)
Marlborough (beat French)
Wellington (Waterloo)
Montgomery (El Alamein)
Churchill (leader rather than Hero -and descendant of Marlborough)
Lawrence (only Brit hero in WWI?)
Bader (disabled WWII Spitfire pilot)

Celtic

Boudicca (slaughtered 000's of Romans)
Arthur (if he existed)

Welsh

Llewellyn (last Welsh native prince)
Glyndwr (led revolt in 14th C)

Irish

Brian Boru (defeated Danes)
Michael Collins (hero to Republicans if not Unionists)

Scottish

Macbeth (not really a villain; first Scots king to visit Rome)
David I (Scotland extended to the Tees; he also founded monasteries and chartered cities)
Wallace (natch)
Bruce
Thomas Randolph
The Black Douglas(these last 2 were Bruce's generals)
Leslie (Civil War)
Montrose (Civil War - possibly the best military leader in Scots history)
Lord George Murray (Jacobite general - never lost a battle until Culloden)

------------

Final List (these heroes are confirmed):

1. Alfred the Great
2. Richard the Lionheart
3. Edward I 'Longshanks'
4. Henry V
5. James Wolfe
6. Wellington
7. Montgomery
8. ...

But please explain your decision.

[Tingkai]

Guderian should be in for German heros. He invented the blitzkrieg, he was a brilliant tactical leader, a great leader of men, and he was one of the first generals in WWII to lead from the front lines instead of from HQ in the back. In short, his contribution to German military history is far more significant than Manstein or Rommel.

[Tingkai]

For the Iroquois (North American Indians) add Louis Riel who led two rebellions against the Canadian government.

Also Joseph Brant, the Iroquois leader during the American rebellion.