Bug list for Patch 1.0.01.141

[Zoetstofzoetje]

idea: if you have a defense pact with another player/AI, could maps be exchanged?

[Zoetstofzoetje]

not necessarily a bug, but it would be helpful if the "enemy units detected" and "city can fire" messages would cancel out
1) when the unit has been destroyed
2) one or the other (the city one preferably)
3) disappear if no possible action remains

[Zoetstofzoetje]

one thing i noticed is: after deceiving my enemies numerous times in the following fashion

Q:"yo, wazza, what are all them military units doing at my border mmm?"
A:"nothing much, just playing cards, watching the game, brother"

they stopped asking me

if this is a feature, i like it

[Zoetstofzoetje]

AI clusters forces at border when player does the same. this is *not* a good thing for the AI, considering the player's first-move advantage when declaring war!
would be much better if defensive positions would be taken up.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

also, if player is stacked up at the border with an AI, and AI is friends with a CS that player is allies with, AI should really really not have units swarming around in that CS's territory under most conditions, even if the AI is protecting that CS.

in that regard, if I'm the ally, AI should take back its guarantee under most conditions as well.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

if you are at war with civ A and civ B at the same time, and destroy either completely, units are purged from the others' territory

e.g. you are fighting civ A and civ B. civ B has a unit in civ A's territory. you destroy civ A. the units from civ B are purged.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

AI does not recognize/prioritize backdoor attacks:

AI declares war on me. AI army moves in to my cities. In between is a lot of empty space. I had an army at the other end of his city though, so I attack through the backdoor. No counterattack, and AI continues to have a go at my city. End result need not be written down..
I checked if the AI would alter course if I moved my units to the back of his units. So in other words, my backdoor army was stationed 0 hexes away, touching his units. Instead of taking out my army first (which is a threat to his city, and his army is barely a threat to my city), he ignores my units.

I'm guessing the AI is programmed similar to the AI_ATTACK script in Civ4.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

guided missiles receive damage (!!) while exploding on enemy units. bonus points for being captain obvious

[Zoetstofzoetje]

defensive buildings cannot be sold. but, what if i want my city to be conquered? there are some legitimate reasons to sometimes desire this. real life examples of (castle) walls beings sold/dmolished: monastery of sacramenia in spain by the spanish, walls of jerusalem by the ottomans.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

mongolian campaign does *not* check victory conditions as it says it does - i ran out of time without having conquered the last civ, but i did have its capital. apparently the game considered that enough. it should check for total destruction.

[Jaybe]

guided missiles receive damage (!!) while exploding on enemy units. bonus points for being captain obvious

I have suspected (but do not KNOW) that guided missiles can be intercepted by aircraft and anti-air defenses. That damage to the missile reduces the damage it inflicts on the target.

Considering the defense weapons that have come online by this date, even against mach 3 missiles, (after decades of there BEING no defense), I commend this mechanic.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

sure jaybe, but the problem is that with the civ5 mechanic a military engagement of this sort is a mutual exchange of damage. in this particular case, that means the missile could be destroyed by air defense, and still damage the target. what you say cannot be correct, as that would imply that damage delivered is calculated after the damage is delivered.

instead, it should be a form of melee engagement, where one party has time priority in delivering damage.

or is there somehow a tiering system in place that we are not aware about?

[Jaybe]

or is there somehow a tiering system in place that we are not aware about?

Oh, definitely go with this one!

I have seen a missile do very little damage, and yes, I believe there were anti-air assets involved. Since damage MAY represent not only damage but "capability expenditure" (ammo/fuel/readiness state), it CAN be rationalized that way.

--
As a major fanboy (frequently have I undergone that accusation!!) and being familiar with wargame design via my SPI/S&T magazine experience, I believe a MAJOR failure of many complainers of the civ series is their lack of appreciation of abstraction in the art. After all, what is even a 'zone of control' other than an abstraction of reaction, firepower and 'fuzziness of location' of the involved unit?

When you are not the game designer and don't have access to their notes & insights (as we did in the SPI days), you have a responsibility to your own game enjoyment to rationalize away as many game 'rogue events' as you can. Willingness to use imagination is necessary.

[Zoetstofzoetje]

I threw a cruise missile at a knight once - 1 damage only. There might be just a diceroll involved.

You're right about imagination - games are indeed an abject abstraction at best, and we have to make do. But are we not entitled to logical cohesion for narration?

[Jaybe]

But are we not entitled to logical cohesion for narration?

Yes, we are! For that, note my sig and, if Firaxis would put more lip service into realism and carry on a dialogue (or monologue, even) of their rationales for design decisions, they would better serve the civ community.

I do NOT play civ as 'just a game' (yeah, it shows my weirdness, I know). I play it for the immersion, and that is enhanced by perceived realism, be it obvious or very abstract. Those people who want to just 'play a game' can go play with a rubics cube.

--
Two bugs, one of .141 nature, another that has probably been around since 21 Sept:
When air units/missiles are put aboard a ship, the air unit numbers stay in place when the ship moves as they used to before the .062 patch; the numbers do NOT ghost in subsequent locations as the ship moves, only at the load point.

If a city runs out of places to put workers excess will be put as unassigned specialists, even if prioritized specialist slots are available! Necessitates manual specialist control.