Civ V Player Wishlists

[wodan11]

And then the Nazis come and start the Siege of Leningrad? Modern warfare will be brutal with this food supply mechanic.

But it does reflect reality much better than the cIV food supply model.

For me, I'd rather it be a little more realistic, at least along rivers and in the modern era (when modern transportation allows long distance transportation of food, and when mass canning becomes possible). As long as Firaxis doesn't allow caravan exploits to come back in.

[Lord Avalon]

What caravan exploits? Nothing to see here. Move along.

I'm hoping it's not too much like Panzer General. While I liked PG, with too small a hex scale, I think you lose the epic scale of building an empire.

[onodera]

But it does reflect reality much better than the cIV food supply model.

I didn't say it was bad, it's just that I was reluctant to be enthusiastic about something that I'd just compared to the Nazi attack on my country.

[-Jrabbit]

Some interesting ideas here; hope they're being tracked back at HQ.

...more different resources. And I would like a limit to their use, so that the oil or gold (or whatever) runs out eventually, and that you have to keep finding more.

And later in the game, technologies that would allow you to find resources where they couldn't be found before.

Excellent thought. I love the idea of finding (or developing!) new food and strategic resources.

I've always thought was a big mistake to set up forests as nothing more than slow terrain/chop material, when in fact, this is one of the great strategic resources through all early eras. CIV is designed to encourage destruction of all forests. Later-game builds like forest preserves aren't worth waiting for. Why not have a sustainable forestry system (a tech) that allows you to grow new forests on rotating plots of land? You could even have multiple grades of forest (soft vs hard wood, fast vs slow growth).

Also having metallurgical development with different alloys producing weapons of varying power and reliability -- like a very sharp sword that becomes ineffective after a few uses, or a trebuchet with a big payload but prone to breakage.

Terraforming would be nice -- tunnels through mountains, canal systems, reclaiming desert -- but must be expensive and time consuming.

Specific religions having an actual (if minor) effect on game play - cool idea

Automated patrol routes - could be land, sea and air - would be sweet

The ability to trade food for other resources (and vice versa) would be nice.

I've also always wanted a "partial build" outcome on troops, rather than the "all or nothing" scenario. So if you're half-done building an axeman, you at least have the option for some sort of defensive value when the barbs show up at the doorstep of your empty city.

[DaShi]

I want to be able to import my Sims into the game and have them tell me how I'm doing.

[Elok]

Haven't played a Civ since 2. The culture-flops lost me. I also found the custom civ-bonuses and unique units something of a letdown--well, maybe not the bonuses so much, but definitely the UU's. I'm of the school that everyone should have basically identical units, only the French call their armored horse "knights" while the Japanese are "samurai." Or call 'em all "heavy horse," so you don't get stuck trying to think up an Aztec name, and simply have them look a little different. It's weird that powers get a sudden advantage at one point in the game for no reason other than "it happened that way IRL."

A while back I daydreamed up an "innovation system" wherein civs gain bonuses based on player performance; e.g., tons of cities in river valleys may "spark" of your people into inventing the shaduf for bonus food production in those squares, while civs with tons of horsemen are more likely to invent the stirrup, gaining cavalry attack. A high science budget increases the odds, and trade with foreign powers may let you absorb their innovations. The idea is to have a partially random system whose odds can be tweaked substantially by good decisions, causing your civ to gradually customize itself for your needs instead of being locked into its starting bonuses. It'd also allow for more minor "real-world" improvements without the need to actively research every little one, increasing historical flavor (reapers, horse collars, crop rotation, the patio process, blast furnaces...), and add a fun and non-game-breaking element of chance. Of course it's way too late to integrate this into Civ5, but then nobody pays attention to these lists anyway.

Supply. I've already mentioned my scheme for this several times: each civ has a "supply range," similar to that ludicrous "culture" boundary (did I mention that I hate that crap?), which can be increased by techs and extended using roads and bases. Failing supply, each square has a forage value, while each unit has a different supply need (spearmen live off the land better than tanks). Each turn unsupplied means a drop in health. This system requires relatively little player micromanagement while preventing unrealistic aggression. You can turn it off if you want, but it keeps the neighbor out of your yard as well as it keeps you out of his.

I can probably rant more about things that won't happen, but it's dinnertime. Ciao.

[Guynemer]

Elok, if you haven't played Civ4, you are definitely missing out.

[Elok]

Yeah, I'm due for a new computer, maybe I'll get IV. You can turn off culture-flop, can't you? Otherwise, no dice. I am NOT losing a border city, with all its defenders, just because the ****ing Persians next door have nicer rugs.

[LzPrst]

Azar Gat: WAR - in human civilization
Must read.

Here's a few points from that brilliant book about warfare.
1. Fighting is not about destroying the enemy, it is about breaking their morale/organization. Units should retreat/flee rather than fight to total destruction.

2. Fighting should be prolific, but low key. Civ has a tendency to make any fistfight into a total war scene.

3. Mercenaries should be extremely important in armies prior to nationalism. Mercenaries should also be able to seize lands from you if their loyalty is low. The same should be true for feudal knights and others who are delegated responsibility. The larger the empire the more odds of it breaking apart. This changes as culture and technology develops.

4. Troops should be easier to raise and easier to lose. With more soldiers, frontline warfare could be made possible. Flanking bonuses would add to this.



Here are a few other ideas I feel should be valuable.

1. Production should not be based on terrain, it should be based on population. Specialist citiziens should be the norm similar to Colonization (though fewer), from the end of hunter-gathering. A city with many blacksmith citizens over time should generate "Blacksmithing Tradition", giving increases to production of metal items such as weapons. The population would be less effective if doing other things than blacksmithing.

2. Food should not be dependent on resources, it should be dependent on terrain productivity combined with "Farming Tradition" (gained by population working as farming "specialists"). Crops should be possible to spread. Food grown in farmland should be moveable, distance based on technology/infrastructure.

3. Cottages should form and grow inside the city, not in the outlying area.

4. Cities should be able to grow into several hexes awarding more lands to utilize for cottages\workshops etc. Farms should lie outside the city as it is now.


The reason behind these ideas are simple. Tying your population into special skills makes sense and is demanding strategically. Cities get production from how many people can put things together, not how many hills a city has in the nearlying area. Here's a suggestion towards specializations for citizens in early ages.
1. Farmers\Fishermen (produce mainly food. certain squares may give other bonuses)
2. Builders (will aid in building city improvements, wonders, etc)
3. Traders (will increase cash flow and give exploration points*)
4. Priests (create happiness and bonuses to certain other specialists)
5. Warriors (cost money, add experience to troops trained)
6. Scribes (research speed boosted, produce culture)
7. Blacksmiths (improves production of certain items, troops requiring metals etc)

The specialists could be handled by slider bars. If you want more scribes, you'll have to up the Scribes bar. For every point over a certain limit, the cost will greatly increase. Building a library will not only boost research, but also reduce costs for higher scribe spending. The result will be that specialization of cities becomes natural and fun.

Buildings (such as libraries and temples) should go up very quickly, but the specialist skills should take time to develop. A library should require culture and tech points to build, not just production. A good way to do it would be to put Library costs to:
10 hammers (produced by builders)
20 beakers (produced by scribes)
5 culture (produced by priests, artists, in general whatever)
25 generics (either production\culture\beakers).

Once the specialized resources are committed, the library is finished. By adding additional points through generics, the bonuses increase up until a max level.


An idea towards making the map bigger:
When entering the city screen, instead of seeing the vast area around the city, you should see the city hex divided into 8(?) parts where different internal buildings can be built, such as cottages, workshops, (+new additions) that will increase effectiveness of certain specialists. As the city grows past size 8, the aroundlying hexes become available for improvement. Farms lie in the regions outside the city. As a city expands it gradually eats away farmland.

[Guynemer]

Yeah, I'm due for a new computer, maybe I'll get IV. You can turn off culture-flop, can't you?

Yes.

[St Jon]

1. I would like Terra-Forming. It has happened in history and yet more now with desert irrigation. I would draw the line at building mountain ranges.

2. Food Caravans as Civ2 are a must as you otherwise waste resources because a desert or mountainous region can never support a major population centre.

3. The SMAC concept of the Crawler Unit allowing allowing out of radius exploitation of resources.

4. Take another look at the CtP concept of Army combat. CivIV has not really advanced from the old 1v1 idea and that is not how war is fought.

5. Make spying more attractive and varied. It is also massively expensive unless you hit gold very early with a Great Spy.

6. I liked the old Civ2 video advisors. No better than any other type of in-game advice but great fun.

[CanuckSoldier]

1. I would like Terra-Forming. It has happened in history and yet more now with desert irrigation. I would draw the line at building mountain ranges.

2. Food Caravans as Civ2 are a must as you otherwise waste resources because a desert or mountainous region can never support a major population centre.

3. The SMAC concept of the Crawler Unit allowing allowing out of radius exploitation of resources.

4. Take another look at the CtP concept of Army combat. CivIV has not really advanced from the old 1v1 idea and that is not how war is fought.

5. Make spying more attractive and varied. It is also massively expensive unless you hit gold very early with a Great Spy.

6. I liked the old Civ2 video advisors. No better than any other type of in-game advice but great fun.

I like the idea of being able to transfer/reallocate food, but I don't think Civ2 style Caravans/transports is the way to go. That was way to cubersome, especailly if you are already moving military units for defence or offence. Some specialist screen would be the way to allocate food transfers IMHO.

CS

[TriMiro]

I like the idea of being able to transfer/reallocate food, but I don't think Civ2 style Caravans/transports is the way to go. That was way to cubersome, especailly if you are already moving military units for defence or offence. Some specialist screen would be the way to allocate food transfers IMHO.

CS

The only "correct" system of city growth and food allocation that I have see was in Master of Orion 2. You have a national x amount of food being produced in all the cities and then cities that lack food can get it with caravans (however, the caravans were automatic, you didn't have to micromanage them). The population growth then is completely separate issue, it is hampered due to lack of food, but doesn't just depend on that. Health and Happiness should be the major drivers of that.

I want:

1. MOO type of food distribution.
2. CtP public works (enough micromanaging those workers, it takes most of the time in my games anyway).
3. Combat will be changed, so I have no comment until I see the new system.
4. Implement religions and make them different. Also implement religious intolerance and prosecutions.
5. We have Independent cities, which was one of the great ideas in the RFC mod, but how about some sort of RFC stability (for those that have not played RFC, if you overexpand/expand too quickly, mess up your economy, use incompatible civic like Police State and Freedom of Speech and many other things, then cities would rebel against your empire and become independent).
6. Low graphics options for those of us that do not have state of the art computers.

[Balerion]

Hello Everyone here,
this is my first post here so I'll keep an humble tone, but I play CIV since its first installment many many years ago (OMG how much time of my life wasted choicing correct squares to estabilish a city).
I do not believe wishlists are greatly useful if a game is under development from over 1 or 2 years but... just to talk, these are my two cents:

- Economy: this is a core part of the game, according to my vision of CIV together with war and technology development, about which I did not read of any improvement in the first CIV V previews and rumors. I hope I'm missing something here because If CIV is a game of choices (strategy) I'd like to see something more accurate and deep in this field eg. taxes, public funds use, interest rates, production levels: after all what we do is manage a Country and we know that is economy to lead most important social choices. And why not, also a little more hystorical realism. But not too much.

- Science: I'd like to see a more complex set of choices in the Tech Tree, with more interaction with Social Policies. And I'd like to see some randomic behaviour as it happens in real life of science (but not completely by chance as someone suggested elsewhere: CIV is a game of choices!!). And why not add some futuristic tech to better distribute the lenght of game?

- Warfare: Supply lines! Supply lines! Supply lines! What is most needed to replicate in the game the dynamics of war is the presence of supply lines, especially in the middle and late stage of the match. Main theme of modern wars is the use of land (above all), air and naval lines to support armies. This obviously requires a more advanced implementation of roads: eg. defenders can damage these lines to avoid fresh units and water/food to reach the front and sustain the fighting ones. This way I must elaborate a complex and complete strategical plan before to go to war: I must send troops in war with a plan.
But I'm not completely sure that add a more tactical or operative level to the warfare (with the "one unit per tile" system) is that good for CIV: this is a strategy game and not a tactic one, this means I prefer not to manage what each single unit does. Too much micromanagement: I'm the Emperor of a nation not a lieutenant. If you like to go in this direction the CTP2 way is way better in my opinion: build complex mix of units (ranged, melee, flanking etc...) to build strong armies.
About the limited strategic resources: interesting but I hope there will be many, many buildings to build; otherwise, when I reach the cap for unit creation, what will I do in my cities? Money, money, money?

These are my greatest wishes for CIV V together with minor ones: better road implementation, terraforming in later stages of game, no more workers but public works logic, etc, etc. (and I must admit I really don't care about fancy leader graphics). Many others will obviously come to my mind 30 seconds after I will send this post.

I like CIV IV and even if I miss something of what I loved in Call To Power series (always take into considearation the good things of the past), I'm sure Mr.Shafer and his team know what to do better than me to offer us fanatics a new and as usual addictive experience.

Bal.

[Dinner]

Welcome to Apolyton!

BTW I really like the idea of supply lines especially as units get more advanced. Sure, ancient units might be able to live off the land but by the time you get to gunpowder supply lines should come into play. It would add a whole new level of strategic thinking.