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Yin was right. Take a look at Rise of Nations

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  • Yin was right. Take a look at Rise of Nations

    as an example of what a good group of developers can do.


    They took a good genere, and made it better.

    They managed to get great graphics, a great engine and all in a very short time.

    But most importantly - they didn't hide behind it, like Firaxis did. In every interview Firaxis reminded people of thier beautiful graphics and big blobbed leader faces.

    Meanwhile, RoN publishers said nothing about it's great graphics yet, and the graphics do appear to be great. They have a great game on it's own.

    They have the most complex and interesting RTS engine yet. So much innovations. And everything appears to be great.

    Tons of interesting ideas, from borders, to culture, to city health, to attrition and supply lines, to rise and fall of empires (using different unique units for every period).

    They invented a whole new way of making resources and knowledge.

    They have managed to get most things we wanted on the Civ 3 list, in a RTS game, and they solved most problems.

    Furthermore, they are a new company with no previous products. Yet they don't seek easy revenue by pushing a game before it's ready.

    Think about it. RoN is already playable for a long time. They implemented almost everything including mutliplayer.

    And still they are not pushing onto us a beta version, like we received a beta of Civ III, but rather are going to perfect this until early 2003 .

    That's a year!!

    They have no money from previous games, yet they take this game serously.

    Firaxis, a well known company with a better financial base, didn't. They are now busy finilizing a beta version of a hardly inspired game.

    They took civ, added the resources and culture ideas, "streamlined" it for dummies, added tons of new graphics and shipped.

    Even with the new ideas I feel I'm playing a dumbed down version of Civ.

    Yet RoN will be a great improved version of AoE. Infact, it will be everything AoE promised to be (something between civilizatios and warcraft).

    This is how you make games.

  • #2
    Wrong forum.

    Firstly, you haven't played the game and it is no where near release, so don't talk about what he has done - because he has done nothing as of yet.


    Secondly, it is just (yet another) AoE clone. And that "great engine" they where able to get in such a short time is no doubt the AoE engine.


    That said, it looks like a better attempt then Empire Earth was.
    Rethink Refuse Reduce Reuse

    Do It Ourselves

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    • #3
      Re: Wrong forum.

      Originally posted by Osweld
      Firstly, you haven't played the game and it is no where near release, so don't talk about what he has done - because he has done nothing as of yet.
      Clearly, you haven't seen all of the "MOO3 will be the greatest game of all time!" and "Let's all thank the MOO3 design team for making such a great game!" threads on the MOO3 forum.
      <p style="font-size:1024px">HTML is disabled in signatures </p>

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      • #4
        It's a clone. Waste of a game.

        How you DON'T make games!

        Now, Firaxis with SimGolf... there is a ****ing game!
        “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
        - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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        • #5
          Imran, why do you keep calling it a clone? It may be in the same subgenre, but there are many significant differences. Just think about the things that Sirotnikov mentioned, plus the peaceful gameplay possibilities, use of combined arms, and ways to limited the effects of rushes.
          "Yay Apoc!!!!!!!" - bipolarbear
          "At least there were some thoughts went into Apocalypse." - Urban Ranger
          "Apocalype was a great game." - DrSpike
          "In Apoc, I had one soldier who lasted through the entire game... was pretty cool. I like apoc for that reason, the soldiers are a bit more 'personal'." - General Ludd

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          • #6
            *blatently on-topic*


            I'd say we should at least play the demo before condemning it as a "clone" or other somesuch.
            "Let us kill the English! Their concept of individual rights could undermine the power of our beloved tyrants!"

            ~Lisa as Jeanne d'Arc

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            • #7
              I call it a clone because it is one. What are the new things? Resources don't deplete, borders, combined arms? *yawn* They should called it Empire Earth II or Age of Empires III and be done with it.

              I don't need to play it to consider it a clone. Empire Earth was a close and so is this.
              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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              • #8
                We don't even need to wait for the demo. Just by reading the previews you can tell that RoN's gameplay will be nothing like AoE's. I'm not going to say the RoN is going to be the long awaited messiah for the RTS genre, but I assure you that people won't be complaining that it is just another clone when it is released.

                Those new items are pretty major, and once again I must mention the peaceful gameplay possibilities.
                "Yay Apoc!!!!!!!" - bipolarbear
                "At least there were some thoughts went into Apocalypse." - Urban Ranger
                "Apocalype was a great game." - DrSpike
                "In Apoc, I had one soldier who lasted through the entire game... was pretty cool. I like apoc for that reason, the soldiers are a bit more 'personal'." - General Ludd

                Comment


                • #9
                  Apoc, it's a clone. It brings almost nothing new, just a few minor things which don't distinguish it from anything.

                  It just confirms that Brian isn't an innovater, but someone who can do things when he is told what to do (ie, Civ2).
                  “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                  - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                  • #10
                    Firstly, you haven't played the game and it is no where near release

                    Exactly.
                    The game is already playable for a long time, and it won't be released for a year. They have a year to improve it.

                    Firaxis didn't do that. What we had was a nice beta.

                    Secondly, it is just (yet another) AoE clone. And that "great engine" they where able to get in such a short time is no doubt the AoE engine.

                    They don't employ AoE people to my knowldge.

                    And finally AOE didn't allow for such elaborate things.

                    If you want to look for what the AOE team is doing, it's Age of Myths (or whatever it is called).

                    That said, it looks like a better attempt then Empire Earth was.

                    Exactly.

                    With several differences. One being it actually delivers.

                    Empire Earth is just AoE with more units and ages.

                    They didn't even revise the resources really. Just added iron.

                    Imran, it is a game. It takes a genere and improves it. A game doesn't have to be original.

                    Hey, AoK sure wasn't original, but it's a very good game. very fun.

                    AC was very good.

                    Civ III is not. It seems good... for several days.

                    But it's not, really.

                    I'm waiting for the final version (ie after final patch) to decide.

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                    • #11
                      Imran, read the gamespy review. It gives so much more details.

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                      • #12
                        Am I correct in my presumption that RoN is something similar to Shogun (having a strategical engine and a tactical engine)?
                        "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                        -Bokonon

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                        • #13
                          No, it's just real time.. but with peaceful actions possible.

                          And I did read it, Siro.. B-O-R-I-N-G.

                          I'd rather play another 5 hours of SimGolf (which I shall be tonight ).
                          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                          • #14
                            Brian has been innovative in the past. Even with Colonization, even though the stuff he did kinda sucked. SMAC was innovative, not significantly, but the innovations were good this time. Now with RoN, he is highly innovative and hopefully they will be good.
                            "Yay Apoc!!!!!!!" - bipolarbear
                            "At least there were some thoughts went into Apocalypse." - Urban Ranger
                            "Apocalype was a great game." - DrSpike
                            "In Apoc, I had one soldier who lasted through the entire game... was pretty cool. I like apoc for that reason, the soldiers are a bit more 'personal'." - General Ludd

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              This game is very clonish, Apoc... that is obvious.

                              You can also say all those RTS's weren't clones because they had 'innovations'
                              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                              Comment

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