Console Wars IV

[Asher]

Originally posted by lord of the mark

So let's say Nintendo employs 300 developers. If you allocate 50 or so to Wii Fit, that's 50 that could've gone to other titles -- a new Kid Icarus or a new Mario, it doesn't matter. [/Q]

So a few less Nintendo first party titles. Important within the Nintendo fan community, but hardly impacts the masses of "real gamers" on the 360.

Now let's connect the dots!

My original comment was hoping MS and Sony leave this market to Nintendo so as to not divert resources from real games.

[Asher]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


Do you seriously think that if all the folks who watched soap operas suddenly started, say, knitting, instead, that would mean an increase in the number of dramatic movies made, thanks to the release of talent? Rather than say a lot of ex soap directors looking for jobs making TV commercials, or finding second careers as used car salesmen?

I really DO think you need to explore the concept of elasticity of supply of labor.

I'm not sure if you know this, but computer science grads are in demand right now. Salaries are inflating at levels such that most grads don't want to settle for game developer salaries (myself included). It's not a simple matter of just hiring more. Doing so degrades your quality and thereby degrades your brand reputation. That's Nintendo's bread and butter so just hiring whoever will work for them won't work.

You're kidding yourself if by changing their focus to making lots of "wii fit" and "soup maker extra fun edition" type games, Nintendo isn't diverting resources from other areas as well.

We see it from a very fundamental level already. Do you think if Nintendo wasn't pandering to the 80 year old woman crowd, they wouldn't castrate their machine in specs like they did? The decision to go to the casual crowd for Nintendo hurt the more hardcore gamers before the console was even launched.

More to the point, if MS went to this direction they would have to do the same. They sort of half-way did this already with the hare-brained "Arcade" SKU, which indirectly hurt all other real gamers because now the HDD isn't standard on the 360. I fear by trying to move into Nintendo's granny market they'd continue to hurt the core gamers like they already have.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles
Just where do you think the internal developers come from? Magical developer farms?

Incidentally, the imagery here is hilarious.

[Asher]

I'm waiting for Wii Farm to come out. It'll revolutionize gaming EVEN MORE. Praise be to Nintendo.

[Asher]

By the way

Didn't see this earlier:

Originally posted by Wiglaf

You can't suddenly change the rules on developers and then blame them.

These rules haven't changed, they've been in place since 1999 in the original Windows 2000 documentation and guidelines. The fact that they've been inconsequential for the vast majority of home users until now is irrelevant. MS has told people to handle installers in this way since 1999, and very few listened -- those that did were mostly business software people who needed Win2K/XP people to install applications on their desktop without the Admin account (due to IT policies).

In Vista, now it's a requirement for everyone. So yes, it is fair to blame the developers here.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles
I'm waiting for Wii Farm to come out. It'll revolutionize gaming EVEN MORE. Praise be to Nintendo.

Isn't that called Harvest Moon? It's actually been pretty successful.

[Wiglaf]

Are you doing having the sex with yourself? What changed recently to make those guidelines suddenly mandatory? Did the computer using population lose IQ points? Did the designer of UAC sleep with someone important?

I'm tired of dealing with your insinuations that my desktop is in userland. FACE FACTS: anyone with a brain has to uninstall software or move around program files to or from the desktop. I've come to the conclusion that you just are playing hard to get. You know what would be funny, is if I dumped urine on you and had to elude some guard dogs -- I think if the urine was that of a girl dog in heat, there would not be much response from the girl guard dogs, but this is just a hypothesis I'd need you to test.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker


Isn't that called Harvest Moon? It's actually been pretty successful.

I like Harvest Moon.

JM

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker

Funny. Those are functionally identical to the cases where you get a prompt in Vista... i.e. when you need privileged access.

Except Apple was smart enough to accommodate legacy applications in a way that didn't invite constant nagging from the new OS.

I don't see any point in denying this. I've actually held off having much of a go at Vista, partly because it's so bad that it isn't sporting and partly because I feel sorry for the poor programmers who were involved.

The whole thing has been a debacle. All the people I know who use Windows and are techies are avoiding it. When I ask them why, they say "Where do you start? Got a couple of hours?". It's crap and a disgrace.

Of course the morons of this world will claim that there's a media conspiracy against Vista or that hordes of Mac and Linux users are creating a false sense of doom (funny how hardly anyone is supposed to use Mac or Linux, yet as if by magic, "hordes" of them have suddenly appeared to call Vista a turd). In fact, the general reaction to Vista seems to be "meh". Not a week seems to go by without some long term Windows using tech journo giving up in disgust and buying a Mac or installing Ubuntu.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Nostromo


And run what instead? Linux? Its an interesting option, but I need to use Office and all my other productivity software.

I've been using Vista for a couple of months now and I think its better overall than XP (and XP was a pretty good OS). Frankly, I don't understand why you and others like you call Vista a "train wreck". Admittedly, the development process was a mess. Admittedly, it didn't live up to its sky high ambitions. But despite all that, Vista is a decent OS IMO. Maybe you could enlighten me? Point out its major flaws, those that make it a "train wreck"? Unless you have nothing, that is...

The fact that it requires newish hardware to run graphics that don't look much better than OS X circa 2001.

It runs like a pig unless you have a pretty decent machine.

The UAC thing that Wiglaf is complaining about has bothered a lot of people. It's no good saying "It's OK for me" because it is pissing off a significant portion of users.

The fact that it is basically XP with nicer graphics for most people.

Microsoft still can't design a user interface (mind you, they can't seem to design anything).

As I said, the general impression from reviewers has been middling to bad. That's not good enough.


But I don't have to use it, the same way I don't have to listen to Britney Spears or watch American Idol. I just pity the rubes who do.

The only thing that bothers me is that Apple forums I go to are now full of noobs who given up on Windows and clog up the boards. It's mildly annoying.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
Are you doing having the sex with yourself? What changed recently to make those guidelines suddenly mandatory? Did the computer using population lose IQ points? Did the designer of UAC sleep with someone important?

What changed as MS actually provided a secure computing environment, which is exactly what should have been done. Incidentally, it's also something Mac fanboys and Linux fanatics have said was wrong with Windows -- that every user was a superuser.

Sorry, bud. You may find it inconvenient but it's not as inconvenient as you make it sound, and it's a necessity in a modern OS.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Agathon
Except Apple was smart enough to accommodate legacy applications in a way that didn't invite constant nagging from the new OS.

Uh. No, they didn't. And if they did, that be an obvious back door -- if you don't want to deal with the security sandbox, just mark yourself a legacy application.

God damnit you are retarded.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Agathon
The fact that it requires newish hardware to run graphics that don't look much better than OS X circa 2001.

It runs like a pig unless you have a pretty decent machine.

Obviously you've never tried to run any version of OS X on a G3 or G4, which is all Apple had for many years.

Unlike Apple, MS doesn't stop supporting their old releases within a year of the new release. Vista isn't for all computers, it's for newer computers. It'll run slower on single-core computers but faster on multi-core computers. That's an intentional design decision, and a smart one -- if you're on a Pentium III, you should not be updating to Vista -- stick with XP, it'll be supported for years to come.

This isn't a valid argument on your behalf, sorry.

Microsoft still can't design a user interface (mind you, they can't seem to design anything).

Oh, I'd so love it for you to actually try to engage in a UI design debate. The last one we had was a few years ago where you were obviously schooled. I remember you whipping out buzzwords like Fitt's Law without comprehending them, and in actuality displayed the shortcomings of OS X as a functional user interface.

The very basic issue is OS X still doesn't have functional window management. Until Expose there was no functionality at all, which was criminal. And with Expose, it's a very inefficient and disfunctional (but flashy) procedure to see which windows are open. Finder is also a trainwreck of a UI.

The only thing that bothers me is that Apple forums I go to are now full of noobs who given up on Windows and clog up the boards. It's mildly annoying.

I assure you the presence of Apple fanatics on normal forums is far more annoying.

[Wiglaf]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles

What changed as MS actually provided a secure computing environment, which is exactly what should have been done. Incidentally, it's also something Mac fanboys and Linux fanatics have said was wrong with Windows -- that every user was a superuser.

Sorry, bud. You may find it inconvenient but it's not as inconvenient as you make it sound, and it's a necessity in a modern OS.

But you don't use it????????????????????????????????????? NECESSITY IS SOMETHING THAT MUST BE USED BY DEFINITION.

Do yourself a favor and avoid Utah..

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wiglaf


But you don't use it????????????????????????????????????? NECESSITY IS SOMETHING THAT MUST BE USED BY DEFINITION.

Do yourself a favor and avoid Utah..

Yes, I don't use it. I'm also a professional.

A modern OS is used mostly by people who don't know what they're doing. UAC and its equivalents on Mac and Linux are essential to modern OSes, period.