World of Warcraft

[Dis]

did second level (meaning high 20's 30's range) instances with my mage and priest. went so much better. I think people do learn to play better. though I also had an SM instance with a warlock not using dot's, using AOE's, and using fear. I was healing with my shammy. It was the first time I ever dropped from a pug group. It helped someone in my guild was doing SM library. so I left armory and went into library. Sweet setup. And that went smoothly.

And I get many kudos with my pally as a healer.

I still need to learn the finer touches of priest healing. They have many more spells and have to use the correctly. This is where playing all the classes help as I know how consecration works. So if I give it enough time, I can use a full heal. But I still think was using full heal too much because it's more mana efficient. I had mana problems before. But this time I never went below 1/4 except when buffing party. I did get aggro on me a few times when things got out of control with runners and adds. but the party did a great job getting them off me. I'm so happy about that. This was not the case with deadmines. but this time, even with the adds, never had mana problems, and no one died. Even when the rogue pulled aggro on the final boss (actually I think the boss attacked him because he got too close- pally was busy with other mobs- i don't pay much attention to the action when it gets hectic- I focus on players). shielded him, flash heal, then regular heal.

Funny enough though, I still think I'm a better healer with my pally even though she only has 2 healing spells.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Sparrowhawk
Feel free to laugh at me, but somehow I still haven't spent any Talent points.

My druid is now level 31, meaning I have 22 talent points not being used, my warlock is level 16 so I have 7 points there.

Originally I hesitated to spend them because I didn't want to screw up, after that I thought I would save them up to spend them all at once, and after a while I kinda forgot about them.

I am tempted to spend all of my Druid points on Feral and hopefully help my character out there. I am also tempted to see how long I can wait before my character is sorely lacking in some areas (already I think I see differences between my character and similar leveled characters, this will only get worse I suspect).

I hate the idea of "respec" of my talents, gold is dear to me as it is so I want to make sure I get it right, but should I quit waiting and just do it (spend them, however I spend them, but just spend them).

On another note, I helped out a Gnome Mage yesterday to complete a couple of quests that were far above him. He was level 18, I was level 30, and he wanted to fight against creatures that were level 27+. I killed what he needed and he got his quest items, he paid me 2 gold in total for the two quests. 2 gold for my druid is a lot, so I was happy to help. I asked him why he was doing the quests and they led to a item that transformed the user into a creature which he wanted to be able to use for PvP. Having never played PvP, I didn't know how it would help him but would be curious to see the fight. Maybe he wanted to change into it prior to the fight so that his opponents wouldn't know what they were facing? Or maybe in the middle of the fight so they didn't know what he changed into?

I don't know, but I am curious.

* Sparrowhawk

transforms into a creature? furblog perhaps? That's a quest in Ashenvale. Wouldn't help in pvp as you transform back as soon as you attack something. Maybe to trip someone out...

And gold was very rough on my druid. as that was my very first character. I have since deleted that char, and my hunter became my main. My hunter didn't have as many gold problems. In fact my hunter seemed to make gold better than my other classes I'm levelling. but I think that's because I did all the quests (I could find). Where my other classes I'm power levelling and only doing select quests.

Once you learn the game, you'll learn how to make gold, and how not to waste it. I wasted some gold on my NE druid buying armor from vendors. Though I kind of had to as I had crap armor. but it's a waste as a druid if you are in cat or bear form. I do think they get a bonus to their armor from items, but for the most part you want +str, agility, and stam. But I do think some of the alliance areas are hard to level and make money. Darkshore can be tricky, as with westfall. Loch modan is easier, but for the mercenaries quest you'll need a group as they are elites.

but the expansion race starting zones have better gold and items. I'm almost certain of it. My chars seem to level up faster and make more money there. Won't help you much if you don't have xp, and they only go to around level 20 or so. But those areas are easier to solo. Got my priest to 22 real fast in dranei areas. And all my horde chars except for my hunter did ghostlands (my rogue only did the later part of ghostlands quests for the dagger reward at end)

Don't know what professions you have, but sometimes it can help to make items that are used in quests. They are always in high demand. Or just make good armor or weaps people can use. Or if you have 2 gathering professions put it all up on AH. Use browse to find similar items so you can price them. I usually put mine up slightly below the lowest up there (disregarding ones with no buyouts).

But I see the value of having a 70 main. As my 2 alliance chars are struggling. Doesn't help i respecced my warrior twice. going protection was a mistake. I was dying too much trying to kill things on solo quests. I don't care if she ever tanks. I don't like the mechanics of warriors too much. And hate switching stances all the time. I am thinking about making a dwarf paladin tank though. Pally tanks may not be viable in end game, but I'll probably never make it there. I can't possibly level so many chars to 70 . But my alliance chars are just broke. I can barely afford skills/spells every 2 levels. My priest is enchanting/tailoring which is a money hog. My warrior is jewcrafting which is a tough profession to level. I know people say to get 2 gathering professions. But I like having a profession from the beginning. I get more satisfaciton over levelling it the hard way.

[Dis]

As for talents, you have to make a decision what you want to be.

I'm feral (both of my druids were). Even though I don't tank much. Haven't tanked since WC. And that was hard. It's hard for druids to tank multiple mobs. I guess you either have to attack multiple mobs to get damage on them, or spam swipe. Swipe was what I used, but you have to get them lines up in front of you. Hard when you are chasing them down when they go after the healer or casters. Didn't help dps'ers were choosing different targets. I also didn't have feral faire fire back then either. That can be used to pull. Had to body pull back then, or shift out and moonfire. After that you have to get some hate built on all the mobs attacking you, or they will peel.

So far, I haven't been asked to tank with my druid since then. I"m asked to heal more often. And I'm more comfortable healing. It's easier for me. but I"m not going to spec restoration. I love being an animal. It's why I'm a druid. If I wanted to be a caster I'd be a mage (and I do have a mage).

So for you you have to decide what form is best for you. If you stay in cat or bear form mostly, stick with the feral tree. It's probably easiest, and faster to level up that way.

I was so happy my tauren druid beat a warrior 1 level above me in a duel. He probably wasn't good in pvp, but neither am I. Cat form stealth. Open with pounce. I think I got a shred in, can't remember. Pretty sure I got him with feral faerie fire as well. I think I just clawed my way up to 4 points then ravaging bite (or whatever the eviscerate type name for cats is). I was trying to clear my combo points before I had to shift out to heal. He was hurting real bad at this point. I figured all I need was a rejuvenation to win. So that's what I did. instant cast, then after global cooldown, shift to bear. I hit him with bash, of course I missed the normal attack after that. But then a maul and he was down. I was so happy to beat a warrior. It's a class my hunter struggles with because of high armor and hp's.

[Jon Miller]

I had no problems with agg or tanking multiple mobs, as long as AoE wasn't used to start the fight from a DPS class.

JM

[Dis]

true, if the party can work with you, it can work. But druids are known best for their solo target tanking ability (though in end game the crushing blows can be rough- warriors can do shield block or whatever for those- druids can't). And true enough, that's where I shined. Bosses never came close to peeling from me. Even when the stupid pally attacked the end murloc of wailing caverns first. I got the hate and kept it.

Here are my talents to help you out. May not be perfect, but this is a solid tanking build. And it's what I prefer. the improved stealth may not be necessary, but I like it. Gets me in trouble with my rogue though. As I get into bad habits when stealthing with my druid, and my rogue gets detected lol. My druid can sometimes walk right in front of green lower levels and they won't even turn (the sound they make when they hear something, but not enough to attack).

most people use those talent point calculator thingies to show their talents, but I"m too lazy to find one, so I'll take a screen shot. The box isn't big enough to show my last 2 talents. I have them in heart of the wild. and I just noticed I have one available talent. cool. I love when that happens. . I have no talents in other trees.

[Hot Mustard]

Had a frustrating instance today. I haven't done many for awhile and was out of practice. I was tanking (BE pally) Scholo and having a rough time of it. Even after a bit when I got back into my old routine, party was still taking aggro, not giving me enough time. Since they didn't want to slow down and do things "my way", we called in a warrior and I offtank/offhealed from about midway through. Couldn't help but feel like I let them down, but also aren't convinced the failing was completely mine. Could also be a sign that pally tanking at that level (I'm 61 now) is just that much harder and I'm not prepared (geared, specced?) properly.

[Dis]

I've always heard paladin tanking is hard at later levels. Definately need top notch gear (but same with warrior tanking).

pugs are tough, seems for every good few, I get some bad ones. Like bfd tonight with my priest. I'm starting to think warlocks are the new huntards. Why do they have to use aoe's? I must have died 4 or 5 times in that instance. Warrior *****ing at me to heal him all the time (he was at 75% and I just put a renew on him). soon as I hit heal I pulled aggro. Warrior was level 20, too low for that instance imho. He only used thunderclap on single targets which is worthless. so everytime I healed with more than one mob attacking tank I pulled aggro.

he left the instance, and we tried seeing how far we could get with a 24 rogue, me a 29 priest, and a 21 warlock (dinged 22 later on). warlock liked using the meteor aoe. At least he only used fear once. His dot usage was sparse. He'd rather blow all his mana on that aoe spell. I spent alot of time healing and bubbling him. We got pretty far with just the 3 of us though. Then a 42 rogue came along, but the 21 warlock managed to aggro something when we were in the water. They chased him into the water, I tried healing him, we both died. At that point respawns at entrance, and we all bailed.

Technically not a pug, guildies from a guild I just joined yesterday. I don't like to bail on instances, as I don't want to create a bad name for myself.

[Sparrowhawk]

Interesting, I just tried BFD tonight for the first time. I was in a group of three, we were all a little high level for the instance, but with only 3 of us, overpowered was okay.

We were a level 36 Hunter, a level 34 Hunter and my level 31 Druid. I was healer, but didn't need to heal very often. The level 34 hunter died once, because of me, I was being attacked and losing badly to an elite underwater, and he came to help me and drowned trying to save me. I survived and resurected him, I don't think any of us were that close to dying other then there. They were both talking about how tough the last boss was, and the mobs after the boss, but I didn't see it. We handled them pretty easily.

Glad to have 3 quests off my list, was a good instance run for me They both completed quests as well (though only 1 & 2 quests) but I don't think they would have gotten xp for them as they both said they were grey for them (my three were all green).

Anyway, not sure I will get back to BFD, had trouble finding a group to go, but instances go much better with a powerful group. (Sparrowhawk states the obvious).

/me

[DrSpike]

Yeah, I used to make sure the group was overlevelled when pugging instances - you lose a bit of xp and save a lot of frustration and pain.

[Asmodean]

Originally posted by Hot Mustard
Had a frustrating instance today. I haven't done many for awhile and was out of practice. I was tanking (BE pally) Scholo and having a rough time of it. Even after a bit when I got back into my old routine, party was still taking aggro, not giving me enough time. Since they didn't want to slow down and do things "my way", we called in a warrior and I offtank/offhealed from about midway through. Couldn't help but feel like I let them down, but also aren't convinced the failing was completely mine. Could also be a sign that pally tanking at that level (I'm 61 now) is just that much harder and I'm not prepared (geared, specced?) properly.

I have kinda lost touch with the game, but from my experience, and what little I can remember of the expansion, the gear you can get is way better than what was before the expansion. So you should be able to easily pick up greens and a few blues that would enable you to survive the tanking bit and then some.

So unless your gear consists of pre-expansion greens, it is not gear that was the problem. Naturally, I can't comment on your spec, but I'm sure there are numerous on-line guides to the best spec for tanking

As for aggro, pallies aren't tanks. They can do it, but it is always an uphill struggle. They got the armor and more or less the stamina for it, but keeping aggro is hard for pallies. Therefore, the rest of the group must be aware of the fact that having a pally tank provides for a different experience than having a warrior doing it. If that condition is met, there is absolutely no reason why a paladin shouldn't be able to tank Scholo - especially at level 61, as the instance was design to be played at level 57-60.

Asmodean

[Dis]

too true. glad it went well for you. after you run a few, you get a bit more comfortable in your given job. if you like healing, balance and resto may be for you for your talents. For solo grinding, open up with starfire maybe. hit the other one (too many beers right now to remember name lol), then moonfire and shift to cat. grab the resto talent to reatain energy/rage while shifting maybe. It will allow you to heal in instances I think. I'm not too familiar with this kind of build, so don't take it as gospel. Too me, healing is easier than tanking. Don't have to run all over the place chasing mobs . Just make sure you keep your tank in line of sight and close enough to heal. keep rejuv up. Keep in mind healing creates aoe threat, so don't hit the heals until he thunderclaps (or consecration as a pally). Or unless he prefers to put a sunder on every mob (though it's easier to just thunderclap- and I don't pay attention to mobs, so I have no idea if the warrior sunders every mob or not). Just watch the portraits .

You don't have anything to reduce threat or fade like priest. So start healing off slow. rejuv first, then renew, then the heal. don't hit too many renew, not mana efficient, let it run its course.

as for BFD, it's a hard instance to get a group for. Really harde for horde. It's out of the way location plays a part in this. Some instances are more popular than others. From what I noticed so far, WC, VC, SM are some of the more popular instances. To a lesser extend stockades and Razorfen kraul. ST is fairly popular because a few people have class quests there (pally and hunter that I know of). Scholo has quests for pally and warlock epic mounts. But other than that it's not popular since the xp came out in Jan.

I'd recommend a stockades run at this point. Put your heals on 1,2,3 click their portrait and hit 1,2, or 3. It's just that easy . difficulties arise if they don't thunderclap or consecrate and the aoe threat will mean mobs pound on you. in this case i recommend standing still and wait for tank or someone to get them off you. if that doesn't happen try to heal yourself. as a priest healer I die a lot in bad pugs . fade helps, but before long after another heal they are back on me. But if I die they can't blame me for not doing my job. It's their job to get them off me. just means a repair bill...

Stockades is real easy to find your way around. everything is square shaped, no mazes. just cell blocks. The biggest problem is runners pulling other mobs. so it's important for the tank or a hunter to pull mobs and not let them aggro other mobs in nearby cells. With good pulling this instance is cake.

Stockades is within the city of Stormwind, so it makes it fairly easy to get a group for. I even found one last night at 2 in the morning (around 4 server time). though a bit harder on weekdays except for evenings. My mage can't find a group for rfk even though I did it once, but didn't have time to grab quests. so try to grab quests before trying to get a group. The instance is between mage and trade districts along the canals. Just go down the stairs.

[Dis]

oh and if you want more challenge, try playin wow whilst drunk so far my levle 8 rogue is doing okayl only detected once in stealth.

I tried offereing to strip for gold, but no takers in stormwind .

so then got on my 70 hunter male and offered to strip for gold . no takers. so then I offered a free run thru any dunger less than 50 (as I think 50+ would be a challeng in my state). Ran one guy thru sm cahtedral. I think he was a 27 rogue or something. BE of course. Didn't really seem to know much about being a rogue. no real good rogue drops there, he just wanted to level. He came close.

[Hot Mustard]

Originally posted by Asmodean
I have kinda lost touch with the game, but from my experience, and what little I can remember of the expansion, the gear you can get is way better than what was before the expansion. So you should be able to easily pick up greens and a few blues that would enable you to survive the tanking bit and then some.

So unless your gear consists of pre-expansion greens, it is not gear that was the problem. Naturally, I can't comment on your spec, but I'm sure there are numerous on-line guides to the best spec for tanking

As for aggro, pallies aren't tanks. They can do it, but it is always an uphill struggle. They got the armor and more or less the stamina for it, but keeping aggro is hard for pallies. Therefore, the rest of the group must be aware of the fact that having a pally tank provides for a different experience than having a warrior doing it. If that condition is met, there is absolutely no reason why a paladin shouldn't be able to tank Scholo - especially at level 61, as the instance was design to be played at level 57-60.

Asmodean

Gear definitely played a part - I didn't realize how bad I'd let it slip. I bought great blues and purple in my late 40s and early 50s, and had only replaced a couple of them recently, as usually blues/purples are good much longer than greens - but I was long since past that point. Went shopping and bought tons of new stuff, few blues, rest greens for now. I'm sad to see my Wall of the Dead go - I used it for 15 levels.

Next hurdle is enchants - I don't know an appropriately level enchanter and will have to ask around.

Edit: Part of the reason I'd been holding off on purchases was that I didn't want to get any pre-BC 55-60 items, especially blues/purples, as they'd be a complete waste. Now that I've cracked 61 I can filter for 61 or higher items and not worry about that.

[Jon Miller]

Paladin's tanking ability was improved in BC. (or so I heard)

JM

[Sparrowhawk]

Originally posted by Dis
too true. glad it went well for you. after you run a few, you get a bit more comfortable in your given job. if you like healing, balance and resto may be for you for your talents. For solo grinding, open up with starfire maybe. hit the other one (too many beers right now to remember name lol), then moonfire and shift to cat. grab the resto talent to reatain energy/rage while shifting maybe. It will allow you to heal in instances I think. I'm not too familiar with this kind of build, so don't take it as gospel. Too me, healing is easier than tanking. Don't have to run all over the place chasing mobs . Just make sure you keep your tank in line of sight and close enough to heal. keep rejuv up. Keep in mind healing creates aoe threat, so don't hit the heals until he thunderclaps (or consecration as a pally). Or unless he prefers to put a sunder on every mob (though it's easier to just thunderclap- and I don't pay attention to mobs, so I have no idea if the warrior sunders every mob or not). Just watch the portraits .

You don't have anything to reduce threat or fade like priest. So start healing off slow. rejuv first, then renew, then the heal. don't hit too many renew, not mana efficient, let it run its course.

as for BFD, it's a hard instance to get a group for. Really harde for horde. It's out of the way location plays a part in this. Some instances are more popular than others. From what I noticed so far, WC, VC, SM are some of the more popular instances. To a lesser extend stockades and Razorfen kraul. ST is fairly popular because a few people have class quests there (pally and hunter that I know of). Scholo has quests for pally and warlock epic mounts. But other than that it's not popular since the xp came out in Jan.

I'd recommend a stockades run at this point. Put your heals on 1,2,3 click their portrait and hit 1,2, or 3. It's just that easy . difficulties arise if they don't thunderclap or consecrate and the aoe threat will mean mobs pound on you. in this case i recommend standing still and wait for tank or someone to get them off you. if that doesn't happen try to heal yourself. as a priest healer I die a lot in bad pugs . fade helps, but before long after another heal they are back on me. But if I die they can't blame me for not doing my job. It's their job to get them off me. just means a repair bill...

Stockades is real easy to find your way around. everything is square shaped, no mazes. just cell blocks. The biggest problem is runners pulling other mobs. so it's important for the tank or a hunter to pull mobs and not let them aggro other mobs in nearby cells. With good pulling this instance is cake.

Stockades is within the city of Stormwind, so it makes it fairly easy to get a group for. I even found one last night at 2 in the morning (around 4 server time). though a bit harder on weekdays except for evenings. My mage can't find a group for rfk even though I did it once, but didn't have time to grab quests. so try to grab quests before trying to get a group. The instance is between mage and trade districts along the canals. Just go down the stairs.

actually the Stockades in Stormwind is what prompted me thinking again about talents.

I have regularly teamed up with two other players, a paladin and a mage of similar level as my Druid, who seem to know each other and talk on the voice thing that they have tried convincing me to get. We were part of a party that did Deadmines together, and when they ran into trouble completing a quest in Redridge, they asked me to heal for them, and when I did so we completed it first try (they said they had both been killed 3 times straight before I helped them out).

Next time I partied with them we went into the stockades and had another druid there as well, the same level as I was who seemed to be much more capable then I was, making me think about talents again.

Anyway, we completed the Stockade and the quests we had, and I like the instance, much shorter then Deadmines but still an enjoyable experience (and with a paladin and 2 druids all able to resurrect, we didn't have much to worry about short of a wipe).

I think I would like to try either Gnomeragan or Wailing Caverns next, but not sure if I should level up a little more first for either (haven't checked level requirements for either).

I had a goal recently of trying to get rid of quests, and my constantly full 25 quests is now down to a more manageable 16. I can actually accept quests again

Talents have me distraught, I like playing all aspects of the game, and feel like I am limiting myself to go all in one (all feral I am considering) but will I be a capable healer in instances when required if I go all feral? My playstyle makes me think I would be best to split my points and not have a "spec" but I am asked often enough what "spec" I am that I am not sure how I would answer if I had all three. (I can see myself getting called a noob already) Generally I answer that I am feral, even though I'm not, little white lie I figure. But right now sometimes I just play solo in which case I could be night elf, cat or bear form, in an instance as a healer or a tank (I won't talk about my limited tanking experience, but my decription would contain the word wipe at least once ). I don't see myself PvP anytime soon, or the larger raid groups.

/me