2013 NFL Playoff Pick Em

[-Jrabbit]

then you've got no cause to be mad at me.

What makes you think I'm mad at you? I'm not. I made an offhand joke last week, and you've been spinning out of control ever since.

[Ming]

What facts have I misrepresented.

You misrepresent facts all the time. And you also make stuff up or just lie.

Ming confirms that nobody's been kicked out of a football league for something that happened in a baseball league.

No... I confirmed that only you have quit in the middle of a draft in either football or baseball... and that you were kicked out because of your actions.

Ming confirms that nobody's been blacklisted, ever.

Exactly where did I say that? Yes, I've claimed that nobody but you has ever quit in the middle of a draft... And you were not allowed in future Fantasy leagues because of it.
And that you keep claiming that you have been treated unlike everybody else. The problem with that is that you are the only person that put yourself in the position by quitting in the middle of the draft.

Ming confirmed that 'I couldn't be trusted in another league', which is what I also stated he believed.

Well this is true. Many people besides me couldn't trust you for future fantasy leagues because you had quit in the middle of a draft.

Berz confirmed that he wrote to you guys after. Ming's confirmed that he was opposed to me joining the league in the first place.

Yeah, I wasn't thrilled with you joining... But, I did agree to let you play and unlike one of your previous lies, I did not threaten to quit if you joined.
The fact is, you were allowed to play... and then you screwed us.

[Ming]

Only JR would post private PMs in their entirety. Maybe I should post the *****y ones he sent me when he was league commish.

Gee... you are the one that started that trend by discussing stuff that happened in PM's with Berz.
But with one big difference... You lied about what was said in PM's... Jr just posted the PM to prove you were lying yet again.

[ColdWizard]

This league is inactive. It's over.

You are pretty much the worst human being on this site. You realize that, right?

This is uncalled for. He was probably raised to be a Cowboys fan and it's extraordinarily difficult to overcome that sort of obstacle.

[rah]

Slowey seems to have done it. Maybe not completely but he's old and I know how that goes.

[Berzerker]

Are you gonna stop sending me PMs telling me to stop bashing Ming?

I sent you a PM about the petty troll in your sig, it was advice and you ignored it

Why are you still smearing the guy who you said was doing you a favor, Berz?

What smear? What favor? You quit... And it aint so much that you quit, its how you quit. You're my friend and even I cant defend what you did. I wont even try, sorry.

You're the one who's been sending me PMs telling me to stop bashing Ming. You're the one who sent me the initial invitation. Now you're on here telling me I need to apologize for my sins. For whatever reason, you've chosen to get involved and try to 'mediate' this dispute by shafting me.

Ever think how I might feel about that?

You feel bummed about not playing FFZ and you blame me, I'll have to live with that. But you involved me when you kept misquoting me, you apologized for that and you're still doing it.

They were and you did warn me about them. You don't thing Ming's being an ******* about all this? That's my point here, Berz. You keep calling me out but covering for him. Never once have you told Ming, publicly, to cool it. Not once. Why is that, Berz?

I told you dont make waves or dont rock the boat, seems water was involved. You were getting a chance to show people you were a good Joe, that you were dependable. It was advice and you ignored it too.

Do you honestly think that if Ming were doing to you what he is doing to me, that I'd be coming on here and telling you to 'confess your sins?'.

I'd hope so, it would be good advice...but if I quit the way you did I would have apologized asap, not that I'd ever quit a league over a player.

Ah. Right. So I said nothing about my brother?

I told you because I trusted you. Hey, the dude who invites me tells me not to make waves. That tells me that there's *******s that I already know who are against me joining and that I shouldn't trust them. I trusted you so I told you what was up. You know them better than I do and I knew Ming would just make up **** anyways (like he's been doing).

You told me about your brother after I sent you a PM a couple days later asking about you quitting. Had you told me to tell everyone your explanation I would have, but you didn't. I sure dont remember any instructions and that left me to post info you didn't post yourself - info you just said yourself was private. I dont remember what I posted at FFZ about it, if anything. Whatever it was, it was probably brief and vague.

Yeah, and why might that be? Because I had **** that I had to sort out and the league wasn't exactly a priority at that point.

Yeah, my bro gets hurt and I'm supposed to be concerned about the league?

But posting rants about Roy Halladay was a priority?

No, I spoke with you, gave my reasons for it and I don't think it's too much to expect that the dude who insisted on recruiting me deal with the fallout. At that point in time, you were lucky to get what you did get. I had a lot of **** on my plate, that really didn't get resolved until that September. Between a busted laptop, my brother, working two jobs, etc.

Given that the league is insisting that because you never actually told them about my brother, yeah, I'd say so. Feels like a perfect setup to me. The dude that folks already don't like, invite him to baseball league, **** on him and you get him out of the other league. Bonus. Then continue ****ting on him forever!

And I'm supposed to apologize.

Yes, you were supposed to apologize and you're still supposed to apologize. That wont ever change until you do. But if you dont mean it... Did you want to apologize to Ming and the other people at FFZ when you quit?

Yep, sure have. Multiple times.

Then you should know why it aint kosher for me to apologize for you, it would be hollow

You chose to get me involved in this, Berz. I didn't go to you and say, "please let me into FFZ baseball." Me saying yes to you is why I'm still getting **** on 3 years later for it. I don't know any league that would be worth that.

I know a league worth more, the one you quit because you didn't get Roy Halladay

You didn't answer me, Ben. If you got him would you have quit? If yes, what would you tell the league about why you were quitting?

Thats what you should have told the league when you quit

[Tuberski]

Boy, do you underestimate him...

ACK!

Told ya.

I wish I could thank myself...

ACK!

[Ben Kenobi]

I thought long and hard before posting that PM

That's actually a violation of your powers as a league commish too, sharing private communications you receive in your official capacity. Say what you will about the troubles I am responsible for, I've never reposted your pms, and I've never been in a position of authority which could be abused in this fashion. I'm not sure why you thought it would help your case, JR.

[Ben Kenobi]

I sent you a PM about the petty troll in your sig, it was advice and you ignored it

Have you sent rah one for his? He's had his up for years now. Like I told you before, Berz. I am only returning the treatment I receive. And even then I'm not going so far as they have. Did you called either Ming or rah out when they called me a pedophile? No? Then I'm not sure why you find this sig offensive.

I know why Ming finds it offensive.

What smear? What favor?

You think you were doing me a favor with the invite? I don't like baseball Berz. I signed on because I believed you guys needed me. Nothing more or less. I regretted it after I saw how the league treated me. I'm not blaming you for that Berz. I think you had your heart in the right place at the time.

Do you think how Ming and rah and JR have acted towards a former player strikes you as conduct you want in a league?

You're my friend and even I cant defend what you did.

So why are you standing behind Ming and rah?

You feel bummed about not playing FFZ

I am bummed that I was kicked out of a league unfairly. Yes, I am upset about that.

and you blame me

No. I blame Ming for that. I know Ming has been saying (and has said), for years that I am 'untrustworthy' to use it to justify kicking me out of all the FFZ and keeping me out of his leagues. He's said so right in the thread. I don't blame you for that at all.

Could you have communicated better with the league? Sure. Could I have done so? Sure. Would it have made a difference? I don't think so. Like I said before, Ming wasn't happy with me in the league and he's made his feelings clear. You were in a no-win situation. I saw it then. That is part of why I was hesitant in joining (and also because I didn't think I knew enough to be competitive) in the league.

But you involved me when you kept misquoting me, you apologized for that and you're still doing it.

I stand by what I said. There was significant opposition to me entering the league but you guys were hard up and enough were ok with it because they saw it as the best of a bad situation. Given what has come out since, I've seen nothing to indicate otherwise. Most leagues would have put this behind them quite some time ago. This one has not. Why?

You were getting a chance to show people you were a good Joe

So you were doing ME a favor? No, Berz. No, you did not. You're still not getting it. Maybe someday you will.

that you were dependable. It was advice and you ignored it too.

Let me ask you something, Berz. Do you really believe you were doing me a favor. Are you doing me a favor now? Is there anything in how this has turned out that has even remotely helped me in any way?

I'd hope so, it would be good advice...but if I quit the way you did I would have apologized asap, not that I'd ever quit a league over a player.

Ok. Then why are you calling me a liar when I made it clear what was going on with me and my brother? Does that strike you as a tack that's going to help you and help things?

You told me about your brother after I sent you a PM a couple days later asking about you quitting.

Yeah. I'm not exactly one for airing business that really wasn't your business. I've been pretty consistent about that.

Had you told me to tell everyone your explanation I would have, but you didn't.

So. Why didn't you tell the rest of the league what I told you?

I sure dont remember any instructions and that left me to post info you didn't post yourself - info you just said yourself was private. I dont remember what I posted at FFZ about it, if anything. Whatever it was, it was probably brief and vague.

Well. Seems simple to me. Someone tells me there's a family issue, I tell the rest of the league that there was a family issue. Why didn't you do this, Berz?

But posting rants about Roy Halladay was a priority?

Like I said, I got home, logged on FFZ, logged on my email, saw nothing from my brother, saw that the draft was on. Called, couldn't get ahold of him. He was missing. At the time I posted that, I had no idea what was up with him or where he was or what was going on.

I eventually got ahold of him and found out what was up.

Yes, you were supposed to apologize and you're still supposed to apologize.

For what? Having a family issue that was more important?

That wont ever change until you do.

Ming and rah won't ever apologize for anything they've ever done. Ever. You're ok with that. You'll get over this too.

Did you want to apologize to Ming and the other people at FFZ when you quit?

Does Ming want to apologize to me for the things he's said? No? Well, then. Guess that's how it's gonna be.

Then you should know why it aint kosher for me to apologize for you, it would be hollow

Why didn't you tell the rest of the league that it was a family issue? That's how I would have handled it if we were in different seats. I'd feel responsible for the whole mess because it was my attempt to fix it and it didn't work. I wouldn't be going around years later attacking the person and trying to get him to apologize.

You didn't answer me, Ben. If you got him would you have quit? If yes, what would you tell the league about why you were quitting?

After I found out he was laid up? Yep. I would. I had intended to run the team with him so we could have some bro time together. What would I have told the league? Exactly what I told you. My brother was in the hospital. Now, bigger question is why didn't you tell the rest of the league that I was having family issues after I told you that.

Thats what you should have told the league when you quit

I did, I told you.

[Ben Kenobi]

Gee... you are the one that started that trend by discussing stuff that happened in PM's with Berz.

Did I repost a PM? No? Two are not the same.

But with one big difference... You lied about what was said in PM's... Jr just posted the PM to prove you were lying yet again.

You've banned people over it before, Ming. Didn't matter the reason behind it. Why are you changing your tune now?

No... I confirmed that only you have quit in the middle of a draft in either football or baseball... and that you were kicked out because of your actions.

So you've confirmed then that nobody, save me was kicked out of a football league for something that happened in a baseball league. Thank you.

Exactly where did I say that?

You're arguing 'nobody's done what you've done'. That presupposes that nobody's been blacklisted, save me, which confirms my statement.

And that you keep claiming that you have been treated unlike everybody else.

I am being treated like nobody else. Logically, everything you've said has confirmed this.

The problem with that is that you are the only person that put yourself in the position by quitting in the middle of the draft.

I'm not the only one who's quit nor am I the only one who's been autodrafted, etc. It's happened before.

Ming confirmed that 'I couldn't be trusted in another league', which is what I also stated he believed. Well this is true. Many people besides me couldn't trust you for future fantasy leagues because you had quit in the middle of a draft.

And yet, that returns the question. Have I quit in a fantasy football league. Ever?

Berz confirmed that he wrote to you guys after. Ming's confirmed that he was opposed to me joining the league in the first place. Yeah, I wasn't thrilled with you joining... But, I did agree to let you play and unlike one of your previous lies, I did not threaten to quit if you joined.

I didn't say that. I said you threatened to quit from Fantasy football that September if I played because I was untrustworthy.

The fact is, you were allowed to play... and then you screwed us.

You screwed yourself, you were short a player. I had already said no. You had no contingency plan in place even after I said no.

[Ming]

Did I repost a PM? No? Two are not the same.

No... you only brought up what people said in PM's. and lies at that.
Which is worse... Lies or the truth?
We know how you feel... lies are your staple. The truth is something that doesn't concern you.

You've banned people over it before, Ming. Didn't matter the reason behind it. Why are you changing your tune for JR?

The reason always matters... so yet another assumption on your part.
As far as Jr is concerned, we are discussing it... as well as your attempt to get around the rules by making claims of what was said in PM's without actually posting it.
The sword cuts both ways.

You were the one that started the PM discussion by claiming what people told you in PM's. Next time, maybe you should tell the truth instead of lying.

[Ben Kenobi]

Hmmm... the draft had started, players had been picked, and you quit.

Right. Had I made a pick? No?

Sounds like the middle of the draft to me.

Had I not shown up you've have BAPAYed me. Is that a preferable option to me leaving and letting you replace me with another player who could actually own a team of his choosing?

You Quit after the draft had started.

I showed up the day of the draft before my pick.

Yes, we bent over backwards.

Thank you.

Which again, hammers home my point. You were willing to do this for the other player, but not for me. Why?

Is it because you believed you were doing *me* a favor by 'giving me permission' to join?

Not helping yourself here, Ming.

You were one that had the negative effect on the health of our league.

The league (and the FFZ league), has had problems with player retention for years. Both predating and postdating my involvement.

You were treated the same as any other player in the league... but then YOU QUIT.

How does that justify kicking someone out of the FFZ football league?

You had enough time to whine about your position in the draft... and then quit when your player was taken.

So you're saying it wasn't an emergency at all? Then I don't see why it was a problem when I left.

Who? You are the ONLY person who has quit in the middle of the draft. Yes, some players have asked for BAPAY's for a few rounds because they wouldn't be around for parts of the draft, but they didn't quit the league. And then they played their teams and didn't whine about the players that they got on BAPAY's.

Vlad's been autodrafted before. Nobody made anything of it.

Now, tell me who's been kicked out of FFZ football for something that happened in baseball. Still waiting.

The reason you were short wasn't because of me, but because of you.

You were short one after I said no to Berz. Did he actually bother to inform you that I said no?

You quit in a FFZ fantasy league

So you admit then I've never quit on a FFZ fantasy football league. So then why was I kicked out of one, when nothing I had ever done warranted it?

FFZ, Apolyton, Whatever Site

So, it's ok with you to drag forum drama from one forum to another? Last I checked FFZ was very big about giving you (and others), a place free of Poly drama.

Why are you bringing FFZ drama here?

... Did you quit a league you made a commitment to? That's like murderer saying "I'm not a murderer because it didn't happen in this town" You are a quitter.

Most basketball players don't play baseball. Jordan sucked at it. Did he quit baseball, or just return to doing what he'd already done?

And there is a reason everyone has decided that you the one to blame for what transpired... because you are to blame.

There was a time when you believed I was treated unfairly.

And one more time... You are the ONLY PLAYER who has ever quit in the middle of a FFZ draft. You can keep trying to say others did, but they didn't.

Has anyone been kicked out of FFZ football for something that transpired in Baseball?

[Ben Kenobi]

As far as Jr is concerned, we are discussing it.

Good to hear.

You were the one that started the PM discussion by claiming what people told you in PM's.

There's a difference between reposting a PM and saying, "I said roughly this in a PM to Berz". I AM allowed to defend myself, no?

Next time, maybe you should tell the truth instead of lying.

Paraphrasing's not the same as reposting. Berz did confirm that he said, "don't rock the boat". Who's lied here? Not me.

[Ming]

Have you sent rah one for his? He's had his up for years now. Like I told you before, Berz. I am only returning the treatment I receive.

Hmmm... Your name isn't mentioned in his quote. So you assume you fill the description of his quote?

And even then I'm not going so far as they have. Did you called either Ming or rah out when they called me a pedophile? No? Then I'm not sure why you find this sig offensive.

I know why Ming finds it offensive.

Gee... where have I ever said that? Oh, I didn't. I do laugh when I see you take something out of context and think you are being smart. Everybody knows your game, so I'm not concerned what BS you put in your signature line. Heck, I could take some of your quotes out of context and show you actually support pedophiles, but I don't. Because frankly, I'm not dishonest like you are, and I don't care enough.

You think you were doing me a favor with the invite? I don't like baseball Berz. I signed on because I believed you guys needed me. Nothing more or less. I regretted it after I saw how the league treated me. I'm not blaming you for that Berz. I think you had your heart in the right place at the time.

Again... you were treated the way you were because you whined about the draft order, and then quit when you didn't get the player you wanted. TRUE FACTS you can not deny.
Blame yourself.

Do you think how Ming and rah and JR have acted towards a former player strikes you as conduct you want in a league?

Gee... weren't you the one that quit? Is that the conduct you want in any league?

So why are you standing behind Ming and rah?

Uhhh... maybe because you are the one in the wrong... making a commitment and then quitting... Please don't forget that fact.

I am bummed that I was kicked out of a league unfairly. Yes, I am upset about that.

Be upset with yourself because it was your actions that caused it. You were the one being unfair by quitting.

No. I blame Ming for that. I know Ming has been saying (and has said), for years that I am 'untrustworthy' to use it to justify kicking me out of all the FFZ and keeping me out of his leagues. He's said so right in the thread. I don't blame you for that at all.

Well... you were untrustworthy... that's what you call people that quit because they don't get the player they want. Again, blame yourself.

Could you have communicated better with the league? Sure. Could I have done so? Sure. Would it have made a difference? I don't think so. Like I said before, Ming wasn't happy with me in the league and he's made his feelings clear. You were in a no-win situation. I saw it then. That is part of why I was hesitant in joining (and also because I didn't think I knew enough to be competitive) in the league.

Well... you made your feelings clear. You whined about the draft order, and then quit when you didn't get your player. It was quite clear to everybody.

I stand by what I said. There was significant opposition to me entering the league but you guys were hard up and enough were ok with it because they saw it as the best of a bad situation. Given what has come out since, I've seen nothing to indicate otherwise. Most leagues would have put this behind them quite some time ago. This one has not. Why?

We allowed you to play, and you broke that trust by quitting after we had started. No reason to ever trust you again. Your actions define you.

Ok. Then why are you calling me a liar when I made it clear what was going on with me and my brother? Does that strike you as a tack that's going to help you and help things?

Obviously is wasn't very clear at all... and also a day or so late...

Ming and rah won't ever apologize for anything they've ever done. Ever. You're ok with that. You'll get over this too.

And what did rah do here... oh that's right, nothing since he wasn't even involved.
As far as me... you were the one that quit. And that action removed you from FFZ fantasy leagues. You are the one that needed to apologize. The league owed you nothing after you broke the trust.

As far as all the other smoke and mirrors... you had more than enough time to whine about the draft order, and about not getting your player. Not a word about family issues.
I guess it was more important to you to whine... that you had time for.

So yet again, the facts here are simple to anybody with a brain.

But keep trying Ben... you look more a fool with every post you make. So I have no interest in you stopping your efforts here.

[Ming]

Good to hear.

Probably not after you hear what actions will happen...

There's a difference between reposting a PM and saying, "I said roughly this in a PM to Berz". I AM allowed to defend myself, no?

Gee... and people are allowed to defend themselves from your lies as well. But I guess you didn't want to see proof that you were a liar.
Until then, you were fine about making up lies about PM's.

Paraphrasing's not the same as reposting. Berz did confirm that he said, "don't rock the boat". Who's lied here? Not me.

No... it's not the same technically. What you did was even worse. You posted lies about what people said... Jr only posted reality.

So if you think you are the high horse here, you aren't.

And yet again, thanks for proving to everybody here exactly what kind of person you are.
But everybody knows what kind of person you are already.