NHL Playoffs

[Ben Kenobi]

I was going to leave this alone but your assertion that I didn't know the criteria for the vezina

You stated the criteria incorrectly. I corrected you. You didn't like being called out, so you personally insulted me. I then stated that you had made your ignorance clear.

Had you responded with an oops, I would have been happy to leave it at there. Instead, you felt embarrassed, so you insulted me. Well done.

Thomas was clearly the best goalie this season in all respects. He essentially did something very special and an epic year in which he was simply the best. He doesn't have enough years of consistent good years to be considered among the greats but this is still a hell of a year

Same with Brodeur in '07. People assessing Luongo's hall worthyness need to take that into account. I'm not taking anything from Thomas, he had a historic season, but Luongo has been consistantly good for a long time.

BTW, do you think if I made a statistic like wins since '08, that Bobby Lou would be at the top of that list? That's a little better then 3rd over cherry picked years.

Iggy winning the Rocket was a joke because he never had 50. The Rocket should never be given out if a player has fewer goals than the Rocket in a season.

[Asher]

Lock for the HOF?

No cup, no hardware, no 500 goals, no 1500 points. He wouldn't be the worst inductee in the HOF, but then neither would Trevor Linden. I find it hilarious that Iggy is a lock, but Luongo isn't.

Iginla is top 3 in scoring for the past decade. Luongo isn't top 3 in goaltending the past decade. Not even close.

As for "no 500 goals". He's at 484 goals. And he has scored 30+ per season for 10 consecutive seasons (and the two before that streak, he had 28 and 29...). He scored 43 last year alone. He'll get 500, and pass that.

How many consecutive seasons did Linden score 30+ goals, out of curiosity...? (Spoiler! 4 -- and every single one of them are BARELY 30). Highest Linden has ever scored is 33. Linden was a good player, but he's not in the same class as Iginla.

Iggy winning the Rocket was a joke because he never had 50.

Who never had 50? Iggy has had 50... He's had 2 50+ goal seasons.

[Asher]

BTW, there are three active players in the Top 50 for all-time NHL goals scored. Iginla is one of them. Selanne and Modano are the others.

Iginla is currently ranked ahead of Denis Savard, Sergei Federov, and Darryl Sittler. Federov isn't in the HoF, but Savard and Sittler are.

He's on pace to pass Lanny MacDonald, Peter Bondra, Joe Mullen, and Jean Beliveau next season.

[Ben Kenobi]

Iggy, no art rosses, no hart, no conn smythes, no cup.

Lots of other players get in ahead of him.

[Asher]

Iggy, no art rosses, no hart, no conn smythes, no cup.

Lots of other players get in ahead of him.

Doesn't mean he's not getting in. He's a lock. He's one of the most widely respected players in the league in addition to his records and stats.

PS: He does have an Art Ross (2002), you moron. And two Rocket Richard trophies. He's also won leadership trophies, an intangible -- the King Clancy and Mark Messier (gag) Leadership trophy. And the Pearson/Ted Lindsay.

[Asher]

There's other things that may play a part as well. He was the first black captain in NHL history, for instance.

As for not winning the Hart...

The Hart Trophy voting proved to be controversial: Iginla tied Canadiens goaltender José Théodore in voting points, but received fewer first place votes than Théodore.[22] However, one voter, rumoured to be from Quebec—Théodore and the Canadiens' home province—inexplicably left Iginla off his ballot. As a result of the controversy that followed, the Professional Hockey Writers Association changed the rules on how its members voted for the award to prevent a recurrence.

[Ben Kenobi]

As for Luongo:

He's number two since his career started. Behind only Brodeur in Wins.

Not bad for a non-hall of famer.

[Asher]

As for Luongo:

He's number two since his career started. Behind only Brodeur in Wins.

Not bad for a non-hall of famer.

Number two in wins? What about his actual stats?

What are your sources?

[Ben Kenobi]

He was the first black captain in NHL history, for instance.

And Manon Rheaume was the first woman, maybe she should be in the hall of fame too.

Look if he's good, he's good.

If he's getting it for being a captain, then Linden is HOF worthy too. Or not, because he's white.

If he's a leadership candidate, then why doesn't he have a hart or a conn smythe? Clearly he's not a HOF worthy leader.

If he's in because of goals, then fine, I can see his case, but his leadership isn't anything special.

Put it this way, Henrik has a Hart, and an Art Ross, should he be in the HOF too?

[Ben Kenobi]

Number two in wins? What about his actual stats?

What? Goals aren't a stat. Wins aren't a stat.

[Asher]

And Manon Rheaume was the first woman, maybe she should be in the hall of fame too.

Look if he's good, he's good.

If he's getting it for being a captain, then Linden is HOF worthy too. Or not, because he's white.

If he's a leadership candidate, then why doesn't he have a hart or a conn smythe? Clearly he's not a HOF worthy leader.

He doesn't have a Hart because of a voting scandal from a xenophobic Quebecois which caused a change in the Hart voting rules.

If he's in because of goals, then fine, I can see his case, but his leadership isn't anything special.

The problem is, it's the package. Iginla scores, he hits, he's defensively sound, he's known around the league as one of the best leaders, he's widely respected by the public at large, he's widely respected by his fellow players, he's one of the top scorers for the past 10 years, he's 10 straight 30+ goal seasons which only 9 other players have ever done. Any one reason alone, save for goals, would not be enough for a HoF ticket, but he's got many reasons.

Put it this way, Henrik has a Hart, and an Art Ross, should he be in the HOF too?

No. He disappears when it matters most. He's not a leader. He's not a soul player. He's playing with a ****ing twin brother who he's played with for decades.

[Asher]

What? Goals aren't a stat. Wins aren't a stat.

What the ****?

How can one man be so ****ing retarded.

Wins are a team stat. What are his sv%, GAA, etc and where do they stand?

How about the intangibles -- you have a G7 SCF, and you poll all of the coaches about who you put in. Does Luongo even make the top 10 in this season alone? I doubt it.

Now ask those same coaches if they'd want Iginla in their lineup for a G7 SCF.

That's the difference between HoF and not HoF.

[Ben Kenobi]

What are your sources?

NHL.com

Since his career began in 1999-2000 season he has more wins than any other NHL player save Brodeur.

The following are ahead of him and played significant time in the 2000s.

Curtis Joseph, Ed Belfour, Dominik Hasek.

All of them, however, had more goals before Luongo started and so have fewer in the time when Luongo has played. Except Brodeur.

[Ben Kenobi]

How can one man be so ****ing retarded.

Beats me. You just asked me for his stats after I quoted you his win total. Apparently goaltending wins are not a stat.

[Ben Kenobi]

He doesn't have a Hart because of a voting scandal from a xenophobic Quebecois which caused a change in the Hart voting rules.

That's not what I expect to hear from someone telling me he belongs in the HOF.

He just wasn't good enough to lead his team to success. He's only gotten beyond the first round once, and that's the same as notoriously choker-riffic and pansy euro people like Henrik Sedin. Who has a Hart.

The problem is, it's the package.

Uh huh. Look, dudes like Toews have a Conn Smythe. Iggy does not. Apparently there will be 20 other dudes who just happened to play in the exact same years as Iggy who were all considered to be more of a leader than him. 40 if you include conn smythes, though there will be some overlap.

Iginla scores, he hits, he's defensively sound

So does Linden.

he's known around the league as one of the best leaders

Yet has never won a Hart Trophy.

he's widely respected by the public at large, he's widely respected by his fellow players, he's one of the top scorers for the past 10 years, he's 10 straight 30+ goal seasons which only 9 other players have ever done.

Only two players have a .917 save percentage in the regular season for over a decade of play. Hasek and Luongo. So I'm not impressed. Even in his cherry picked stat, there have been far better goal scorers and those with way more talent.

And this includes Pavel Bure, btw, who also sits outside of the hall.

he's got many reasons.

First black captain. Awesome. Linden's the first captain from Medicine Hat. He should be there too.

No. He disappears when it matters most.

Uh, he has a Hart dude. Iggy does not. Won more in the playoffs too. More playoff points and goals.

He's not a leader. He's not a soul player. He's playing with a ****ing twin brother who he's played with for decades.

He's that ****ed eurotrash. **** straight. Eurotrash can't lead so they can't be considered for the award.