MLB - 2008 Season

[snoopy369]

Joe Crede

[-Jrabbit]

That was a hard-fought, much-needed win.

[Arrian]

Every team/GM makes mistakes. Every single one.

Of course they do! I can think of several made by one Mr. Cashman. That doesn't change my argument.

Speaking of which, we've said all there is to say. I'm done discussing the relative intelligence/stupidity of the Toronto front office.

...

Freaking rain delay. Phil was pitching well. Meh. Ohlendorf looked so good in the 3rd before getting thoroughly pounded in the 4th. I don't see what the Yankee brass sees in Ohllie. I fell asleep when the Sox were still up 6-5, right after Melky's HR. Apparently Joba lost it in the 9th, eh? Can't win 'em all... though that game was winnable, and that irks me.

-Arrian

[snoopy369]

You shouldn't argue with 2 out of 3 on the road against a division leader. You won't be winning many series like that this year

Wonder why they didn't leave him in. Floyd pitched well into the game (well, one inning too long, but whatever).

Stupid ***** bullpen giving up leads again, though... very annoying.

[Stuie]

Originally posted by snoopy369
Floyd pitched well into the game (well, one inning too long, but whatever).

So has Gavin Floyd finally overcome that deer-in-the-headlights presence he used to exhibit on the mound?

[-Jrabbit]

Both he and Denks are significantly better this year.

So far.

[snoopy369]

Floyd pitches very well when he is in the windup.

He has problems pitching in the stretch, though. He's one pitcher they should consider not using the stretch with, except AJ isn't good enough at throwing out stealers...

[Arrian]

Originally posted by snoopy369
You shouldn't argue with 2 out of 3 on the road against a division leader. You won't be winning many series like that this year

The ChiSox aren't going to be a division leader for long. The Yanks should've swept.

Wonder why they didn't leave him in. Floyd pitched well into the game (well, one inning too long, but whatever).

He's 21 years old. They are being uber-cautious with his arm. Lose the battle, hopefully win the war.

Stupid ***** bullpen giving up leads again, though... very annoying.

Indeed.

As for Floyd, based on seeing him exactly once, he seems to have good stuff, but his mechanics are kinda screwy (Cone was talking about them a lot on the YES broadcast), and I think that results in control problems. He didn't look like a deer in the headlights to me, though it did seem he was unnerved by the footing on the (wet) mound.

-Arrian

[snoopy369]

Floyd is pretty young also... Maybe not 21 but still.

He was unnerved by pitching in the stretch. The footing thing was just a delaying tactic to allow him to catch his composure

[Imran Siddiqui]

Floyd is 25 (Hughes, btw, is 22).

Furthermore, keeping pitchers in after rain delays is always dicey. Maybe the extra years on Floyd convinced the White Sox that he could be kept in without lasting damage.

[-Jrabbit]

Nah, just Ozzie playing a hunch. He's definitely a "feel" manager.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Dangerous hunch .

[snoopy369]

I don't see why keeping a pitcher in after a short delay (53 minutes) is a big deal. He may or may not be as effective (harder to keep it up) but it's not like it's that much longer than just one big inning by the batters (which also can have a slightly negative effect, but usually isn't enough to take out a pitcher).

Average what, 20 minutes per inning? Just have him pitch a fake inning every half hour of the rain delay and cause that to count for his pitch count. I don't see why a pitcher should be pulled after a short rain delay after the second inning regardless.

[-Jrabbit]

From today's NY Times:

...when rain forced the second delay, Hughes’s spot became tenuous. The delay lasted 51 minutes, and when play resumed, it was Ross Ohlendorf, not Hughes, on the mound.

“We made a decision as a staff that it was best not to send him out there,” Girardi said, adding later, “I just went up to him and said, ‘I know it stinks, but this is what we’re going to do.’ ”

Hughes had lost his last three starts, but he said he felt better this time, staying tall over the rubber and driving his pitches toward the plate with a downward angle. He understood why Girardi pulled him, but he was frustrated.

[snip]

It seemed to be poor planning by the Yankees, who have not carried a traditional long reliever all season. They have needed one repeatedly, but instead have pushed the job on Ohlendorf, who pitched in a short-relief role in spring training.

[snip]

On Sept. 12, 2006, as the Florida Marlins’ manager, Girardi let the rookie Josh Johnson stay in after an 82-minute rain delay. The next season, Johnson needed reconstructive elbow surgery, and Florida owner Jeffrey Loria implied that Girardi was to blame.

A similar scenario would be devastating to the Yankees, and Girardi took no chances.

[snoopy369]

I understand the argument, but i think it's baloney. (And 82 is much more than 53, but still) 53 minute delay, have him throw 10-15 pitches at the start and 10-15 pitches every 20-30 minutes, you'll be fine (and of course not many fastballs or slider/curves, so he doesn't wear out as much). Keep him in for 4-5 innings that way, 80ish pitches.

Also, Loria is an ass.