NFL - Are you ready for some Football - Week 5

[-Jrabbit]

Originally posted by Lorizael
My problem with this "tactic" is that it has absolutely nothing at all to do with playing the game of football.

Who wants to win a football game this way? Where's the fun in that?

This is professional sports, and it's not about fun. It's all about winning any way you can. Preferably within the rules.

The people whining about it fail to acknowledge that this tactic has equal chances of backfiring and succeeding.

[Lorizael]

Originally posted by -Jrabbit
This is professional sports, and it's not about fun. It's all about winning any way you can. Preferably within the rules.

Yeah, hence the, "If I were a coach I'd do it, too," part. But I don't think this should be a part of the rules. I don't think this should be a part of the game. To me, this isn't what the sport of football is supposed to be about. *shrug* but that's just my opinion.

The people whining about it fail to acknowledge that this tactic has equal chances of backfiring and succeeding.

Probably not. There definitely is that chance, but I think it's more likely that you'll screw with the kicker's nerves than reinvigorate him with a second chance.

And, all things being equal, a kicker is much more likely to successfully kick a field goal than not, so there are going to be many more times when this is the right move (first kick is good, second kick misses because the kicker is "iced") and not the wrong move (first kick is bad, second kick is good).

[Ming]

I really can't wait for somebody to miss the time out field goal, and then make the second one.

That will probably stop this kind of stuff. Can't you see the headlines now... COACH LOSSES GAME!

[snoopy369]

It's always going to work more than it will not work, though. So far it's what, 2 out of 3 ended in misses the second time? The kicker doesn't gain much of anything from the first attempt that he can use in the second (they're already very good at judging wind etc.), so the only thing that comes into play is his leg being tired (and it is tired after the first one don't doubt, he puts everything he has into each kick when it's near the edge of his range) and the mental isues.

JR, the issue is that I don't think mental games should be part of football, and you do. I think football is a game of physical prowess, and shouldn't be sullied by mind games.

And I have no doubt this will change (though it would've been a sure bet if Jerry Jones had lost the game because of it). After all, if they don't let people spike the ball or do dances in the end zone, which are about the mental games, why would they allow this?

[SlowwHand]

It's mind driven, unless you're of the 3 yards and a cloud of dust mind.
It's all about influencing the other team.
Examples being screen passes, play action passes, stacking the defensive line then backing off, and so on.

[snoopy369]

All of those things require skill, however. There is a difference between trick plays - which are looked down on anyway as only for teams that have no chance otherwise - and a coach pulling a fast one

[-Jrabbit]

Originally posted by snoopy369
JR, the issue is that I don't think mental games should be part of football, and you do. I think football is a game of physical prowess, and shouldn't be sullied by mind games.

And I have no doubt this will change (though it would've been a sure bet if Jerry Jones had lost the game because of it). After all, if they don't let people spike the ball or do dances in the end zone, which are about the mental games, why would they allow this?

Like most good team sports, I think football is a game of physical skills, strategy and execution. It is constantly replete with mental games, attempting to influence all phases of play. Interestingly, I haven't heard a player complain this tactic is unfair. I would posit that this is precisely because every part of their world is about flawless execution under duress.

BTW, comparing on-field celebrations to icing the kicker is ridiculous on the face of it. If anything, it's comparable to icing a free throw shooter in basketball -- which happens all the time with the game on the line.

Here's an interesting note:

I had ESPN on this afternoon, and one of their football maven shows came on, with the usual panel of studio experts. Predictably, most were railing about how this rule is changing outcomes, and that it must go as soon as the season is over. It's the populist voice. Then they got to a coach. He said: "What's the big deal? There's no whining in football. You're a professional kicker. You're asked to kick, you kick. You make it, you stay employed. You miss, you don't have what it takes."

Now here's a little history, and the reported current thinking:

The current rule, allowing coaches to call a timeout from the sideline, is relatively recent. It was put in by the competition committee at the request of the coaches. They felt the need to have that option, because games were being lost through the inability to exercise clock management. The comp committee is all for exciting finishes, and agreed. This was described as happening "a few years ago." Obviously, this new form of icing is an outgrowth of that rule. Previously, the timeout had to be called on the field, by a captain. Coaches like having control.

Reportedly, there is very little movement currently among coaches and team management toward rescinding this rule. While some coaches are willing to risk the "icing" strategy; some (including Tony Dungy) think it's a stupid and risky move. But few if any are willing to give up the option.

So while this will certainly be discussed at the winter meetings next March, it currently looks like there is very little impetus inside the league to have it changed. Perhaps they'll try to modify it somewhat, but that leads to "where do you draw the line" issues.

We'll see.

[-Jrabbit]

Originally posted by snoopy369
All of those things require skill, however. There is a difference between trick plays - which are looked down on anyway as only for teams that have no chance otherwise - and a coach pulling a fast one

I would say they're exactly the same in spirit.

BTW, Tomlinson is the leading active passer among non-QBs, and Cowher made it virtually a policy to use at least one "trick play" per game. These are not people I would describe as having "no chance otherwise."

[snoopy369]

I preferred Shaun King's explanation, which will be the one and only time I ever say that

[SlowwHand]

If we're going there, what about a QB's cadence.
A center tightening his grip, early. A defensive player faking a charge to try and make a dimwit offensive player jump offside?
That's strategy.
All of which can be called a penalty under circumstances.

[Lord Avalon]

Panthers sign 43-year-old Testaverde

CHARLOTTE, N.C. (AP) -- Vinny Testaverde isn't finished yet -- even at age 43.

The Carolina Panthers, desperate for a backup quarterback with Jake Delhomme out for the season, signed Testaverde to a one-year deal on Wednesday.

Testaverde, the No. 1 overall pick by Tampa Bay in the 1987 draft, is joining his sixth franchise. He has played in 226 games with 208 starts. He was cut by New England before the start of the season.

"We decided he was our best option," general manager Marty Hurney said. "He brings experience. He throws the ball extremely well. He's a fierce competitor. It seems like he'll be an extremely good fit for us."

Testaverde will provide insurance behind David Carr, who became the Panthers' No. 1 QB on Monday when the team announced Delhomme would have season-ending elbow surgery.

Carr himself is banged up after suffering a back injury in Carolina's win over New Orleans on Sunday. Matt Moore, who played briefly Sunday when Carr was being treated, is the only other quarterback on the roster.

Delhomme was officially placed on injured reserve Wednesday to make room for Testaverde, who flew into town early Wednesday and passed a physical.

Hurney said he has no concerns with Testaverde's age. He'll turn 44 next month.

"If you watched him in preseason, he threw the ball extremely well," Hurney said. "He played in two preseason games -- one was against us -- and he still showed the ability to compete in this league.

"He's a guy who take extremely good care of himself."

The available pool of quarterbacks was thin, and the Panthers were in competition with their opponent on Sunday, Arizona. The Cardinals signed Tim Rattay on Tuesday after it was learned Matt Leinart would miss the rest of the season with a broken collarbone.

The 6-foot-5 Testaverde certainly brings experience. He ranks sixth in NFL history 6,529 pass attempts, 3,693 completions and 45,281 passing yards. He's ninth with 270 touchdown passes and tied for 10th with 30 300-yard passing games.

Testaverde's best statistical season came in 1996 with Baltimore, when he made the first of his Pro Bowl appearances, throwing for 4,177 yards and 33 touchdowns.

Testaverde also made the Pro Bowl in 1998 with the New York Jets.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/10/10/bc.fbn.panthers.testaverde.ap/index.html

[Straybow]

Aaaaayyyy, Vinnieeeee!

[Theben]

Originally posted by -Jrabbit

As for you, Theben -- you're not even in the same state.

I lived there for 2/3rds of my life, and held up the torch for the Bears here in Indy all last year, including the Super Bowl.

Chicago boy at heart.

[SlowwHand]

Oct 10 Harvey Fialkov and Omar Kelly, of the South Florida Sun-Sentinel, report Miami Dolphins WR Marty Booker will be the team's emergency quarterback Week 6.

[Lord Avalon]

Humminah .... humminah ... humminah ...