CIA-backed coup attempt in Georgia

[Berzerker]

Wow! So do you recognize that much more civilian damage has been documented in the last year in the Donbas than in the previous 8 years, let alone the years of 2014 to 2015?

If Azov and the Ukrainian right were inflicting the damage before, why was so much more inflicted later on this most recent year? Were the Nazis pulling their punches because they thought the Donbas was largely bending the knee?

I dont know that, neither do you. Millions fled the Donbas and the ones who stayed hate the Nazis, they've been shelled by them for over 9 years now. Where did you get the idea they blame Russia? Amnesty Intl got in serious trouble last year for reporting the Ukrainian tactic of using civilians as shields, they'd move in to launch attacks from populated areas (yes, hospitals and schools) and blame the Russians if the counter attack killed civilians.

So tell us, how many civilians in the Donbas have been killed by the Russians and who do the people there blame for it? They know who their friends are, many fled to Russia when Azov attacked them. You ignore them as victims when Ukraine kills them and then cite them to blame Russia for defending them. Do you think the people of the Donbas will vote to stay in Ukraine when this is over?

[Berzerker]

maybe we should continue this in the Ukraine thread and let this one go. I meant to copy that to the other thread but forgot

[Serb]

Serb, 'm surprised you took this long to recognize Berz. When you get fed up and leave us for a while Berz would keep fighting the battle.

I take you for the sane person too.

[Serb]

Wow! So do you recognize that much more civilian damage has been documented in the last year in the Donbas than in the previous 8 years, let alone the years of 2014 to 2015?

Actually the level of shelling of Donbass has drastically dropped now. If in February of 2022, when Ukraine has started it's massive artillry barrage prior to their planned invasion, that was about 1500 artillery shells shot on DPR cities PER DAY, now it's only 250-350 shells per day.
That is a five time decrease, because Russians have pushed the border further West to prevent DPR cities shelling.
As for Lugansk, it is like day and night! The Ukronazis have no capability to shot civilian blocks of LPR cities anymore.

If Azov and the Ukrainian right were inflicting the damage before, why was so much more inflicted later on this most recent year? Were the Nazis pulling their punches because they thought the Donbas was largely bending the knee?

Because that is not true and I don't know where you get this info.
Azov and all other Nazi battalions are a top priority for Russians to destroy.

The Nazis go to hell!!!

[Serb]

The Nazi "heroes" who had killed, raped and tortured Russians are always end-up like that!
The end is inevitable!
We will win!!!

[Serb]

I dont know that, neither do you. Millions fled the Donbas and the ones who stayed hate the Nazis, they've been shelled by them for over 9 years now. Where did you get the idea they blame Russia? Amnesty Intl got in serious trouble last year for reporting the Ukrainian tactic of using civilians as shields, they'd move in to launch attacks from populated areas (yes, hospitals and schools) and blame the Russians if the counter attack killed civilians.

So tell us, how many civilians in the Donbas have been killed by the Russians and who do the people there blame for it? They know who their friends are, many fled to Russia when Azov attacked them. You ignore them as victims when Ukraine kills them and then cite them to blame Russia for defending them. Do you think the people of the Donbas will vote to stay in Ukraine when this is over?

That's right!
If it were Russians who are killing them, they would not flee to Russia. Simple as that, Geronimo.
There are millions of Ukranian refugees fled to Russia and that is a fact!
You don't flee to your enemy seeking for protection, if he is killing you.

[Geronimo]

It's you who had taken a full control of this country and leaded it to disaster, to a bloodbath for 8 years, not us!
If Russia did something alike to Mexico, USA would have responded in 1,2,3, AFTER A FEW DAYS, without waiting for 8 years while the ethnic Americans there have been slaughtered by the puppet goverment.

How would the US arming separatists to carve chunks of Mexico off and then later invading with the regular US armed forces to formally annex Mexican territory, be in any way better than what the US and its allies have done in Kosovo?

[Geronimo]

I take you for the sane person too.

Thanks I guess, but I think my "sanity" as assessed by you Serb is probably not as solid Berz's. I do generally assume any media anywhere could be publishing lies, either because powerful forces can fool them or because it's in their interests to lie. These days the most common reason US media lies is to retain their loyal viewers/readers who demand that sort of "truth" from their news sources. This means I'm willing to entertain the possibility that "alternative" narratives may be much closer to the truth on any given issue and I try to step back and see which narratives on a given issue are the most consistent with everything else they have to say and consistent as well with kinds of persistent realities I can identify that can't readily be hidden from the public. Having said all of that, I also have not one but two Ukrainian coworkers and I'm barely in contact with my Russian friends and former Russian coworkers so that lens definitely filters my view of everything to do with Ukraine. I wouldn't hold out much hope for me Serb.

[Serb]

Trust me, you are not hopeless!

[Geronimo]

Actually the level of shelling of Donbass has drastically dropped now. If in February of 2022, when Ukraine has started it's massive artillry barrage prior to their planned invasion, that was about 1500 artillery shells shot on DPR cities PER DAY, now it's only 250-350 shells per day.
That is a five time decrease, because Russians have pushed the border further West to prevent DPR cities shelling.
As for Lugansk, it is like day and night! The Ukronazis have no capability to shot civilian blocks of LPR cities anymore.


Because that is not true and I don't know where you get this info.
Azov and all other Nazi battalions are a top priority for Russians to destroy.

The Nazis go to hell!!!

Let's narrow it down. When was the last time Donetsk was out of range of Ukrainian artillery? Basically never correct? So if Ukraine was mostly pursuing death of Russian speaking civilians in the Donbas by artillery from 2014 onwards, why the hell would Mariupol be so much more obviously heavily damaged than Donetsk? Furthermore why the hell was the Donetsk airport so much more massively targeted than Donetsk proper? A hell of a lot fewer civilians were present to kill at the airport. If you look at the where Ukrainians generally shelled, it looks as if they were going after tactical targets definitely not civilian targets. I get this info that Ukraine did not appear to be interested in wasting artillery just to kill civilians by looking at the results of what they have done.

Let's look at the level of damage in Mariupol right after its capture last summer. Prior to last February, The Donetsk airport is clearly the only place that saw anywhere near this level of damage. Serb you have blamed the damage on the Ukrainians. if the Ukrainians had the means to devastate Mariupol anywhere near that badly in a couple months and the objective of their operations in Donbas were to kill Russian speaking civilians it makes zero sense that Donetsk would not have been almost totally destroyed since 2014 and little sense that the airport would take the brunt of it.

Where do you get your Ukrainian artillery operation information?

[Geronimo]

That's right!
If it were Russians who are killing them, they would not flee to Russia. Simple as that, Geronimo.
There are millions of Ukranian refugees fled to Russia and that is a fact!
You don't flee to your enemy seeking for protection, if he is killing you.

Sure they would. This happens in wars all of the time. Do you have any idea how many millions of Vietnamese went all the way from Vietnam to live in the US not just while the US was occupying and invading and bombing Vietnam but also after the US entirely pulled out of the area? The US gets a bolus of immigrants from every country it occupies. Kurds in Syria under attack by Turkish armed forces stream across the border into Turkey would be another example. About the only time civilians won't depart via the shortest route to the closest border that avoids the front lines is if an army stops them. In world war 2 just about every continental civilians population crossed every frontier they weren't turned away from to escape the fighting.

Within the first few days of the the start of the special operation, the only country millions of Ukrainians could escape to without crossing the battle lines was...Russia!

[JohnT]

The Ukrainians destroyed their city while our army is destroying Ukrainians is some galaxy brain level sh1t, that is for sure.

[Serb]

Sure they would. This happens in wars all of the time. Do you have any idea how many millions of Vietnamese went all the way from Vietnam to live in the US not just while the US was occupying and invading and bombing Vietnam but also after the US entirely pulled out of the area? The US gets a bolus of immigrants from every country it occupies. Kurds in Syria under attack by Turkish armed forces stream across the border into Turkey would be another example. About the only time civilians won't depart via the shortest route to the closest border that avoids the front lines is if an army stops them. In world war 2 just about every continental civilians population crossed every frontier they weren't turned away from to escape the fighting.

Within the first few days of the the start of the special operation, the only country millions of Ukrainians could escape to without crossing the battle lines was...Russia!

The only problem with that logic is that they have started to evacuate to Russia a week before the "Russian invasion", because these were Ukranian shells, which were killing them!

[Serb]

The Ukrainians destroyed their city while our army is destroying Ukrainians is some galaxy brain level sh1t, that is for sure.

Donetsk and Lugansk, as well as the rest of Donbass was NEVER Ukrainian!
Donbass is a land of Russians, populated by Russians for many centuries, but given to Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic in 1920's by the Communists, whom you hate so much!
So, the Ukrainians were never destroying their cities - they were destroying RUSSIAN cities, populated by Russians, whom they hate!
Like Germans hated Jews under the Hitler!!!

A Western dummy!

[JohnT]

Ming, is it against the rules to tell someone to fvck off? Asking for a friend, need answer fast.

[Serb]

You are lol John!
Welcome to the 21st century!

[Serb]

What's-up, boy?
You can compare other brain ability with a

sh!t

(that is a quote), but then go crying, calling for mommy, when you are beated?