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WW2 Soviet Revisionism Has Gone too Far

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  • WW2 Soviet Revisionism Has Gone too Far

    Okay, I get it. The USA has flooded the world with mass media, so we've sent so many USA-centric depictions out over the past 70 years, and considered the Soviet Union an arch enemy, so of course their contributions have been understated.

    But I think the pendulum has swung too far the other direction. People are making it sound like the USSR singlehandedly saved all of Europe. It's like the kid who discovers there's more than just pop music, suddenly they think they know it all.

    Consider the following points:

    1) USSR invaded Poland and all the Baltic States, and signed a non aggression pact with Germany, handing over mainland Europe to Hitler

    2) UK was not some little desperate island as is often depicted. Though waning, it was the premiere empire in the world at the time, with control of the seas. An invasion of England had very little chance of succeeding. Hitler wanted peace but it got rejected.

    3) Once Japan attacked the USA, the USA relieved the USSR of its eastern flank, letting it free up its best troops and its best general. This point is the most understated of all and is forgotten.

    4) Strategic and terror carpet bombing effects are also understated. The often cited statistic is that Germany's wartime production by tonnage actually increased as the war went on. This is a failed logic for the following reasons:
    * Anyone who knows anything about supply chain knows:
    ** The difference between gross and net. Maybe I supply you 50,000 tons more gear than I did last year, but if it gets blown up in transit, it's just as useless
    ** Disruption. Shortages of key material can delay and even cripple manufacturing.
    ** Diversion of material. If I have to spend all my resources building bunkers and moving stuff, that's less time I have to spend actually making it.
    ** Germany only switched to a total war production footing late in the game. Hitler correctly understood the home front could be demoralized by asking them for sacrifices (just as in WW1), but incorrectly implemented a home front production strategy.

    * Diversion of air cover. Soviets relied on huge overwhelming tank formations. Germany had to redirect alot of resources towards civilian protection, this strained the Luftwaffe, which could have left those huge tank formations stuck in a stalemate and dragged on the war indefinitely.

    5) Poland and France ate up a ton of German resources, and their partisan resistors were key in harassing occupation forces and providing manpower

    6) Soviet doctrine is to blame for the huge numbers of casualties suffered. Instead of using tactical withdrawal to save millions of troops, they were given stupid orders to stand their ground and let themselves get encircled. This did not delay Germany. If anything, it sped it up. So yes, there's huge numbers of casualties, but that's to blame on Stalin himself. Zhukov is on record several times stating he did not agree with the human wave tactics and they were useless.

    The REAL unsung heroes of WW2 were the Nationalist Chinese.
    Last edited by Ted Striker; January 15, 2020, 17:21.
    We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution. - Abraham Lincoln

  • #2
    They make it sound like the Russians did 99% of the fighting in Europe when it was really just 90%.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Ted Striker View Post
      Zhukov is on record several times stating he did not agree with the human wave tactics and they were useless.
      Maybe, until you're facing killbots with a preset kill limit.
      Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
      "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

      Comment


      • #4
        If it weren’t for the Soviets we would all be speaking Russian.
        One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

        Comment


        • Uncle Sparky
          Uncle Sparky commented
          Editing a comment
          Nyet, Nyet, Soviet!

      • #5
        Unbelievably timely thread since I'm listening to the 'Hunt for Red October' soundtrack right now.

        Oh, and the Russian government resigned, but that's not important.

        Comment


        • #6
          Originally posted by Ted Striker View Post
          Okay, I get it. The USA has flooded the world with mass media, so we've sent so many USA-centric depictions out over the past 70 years, and considered the Soviet Union an arch enemy, so of course their contributions have been understated.

          But I think the pendulum has swung too far the other direction. People are making it sound like the USSR singlehandedly saved all of Europe. It's like the kid who discovers there's more than just pop music, suddenly they think they know it all.

          Consider the following points:

          1) USSR invaded Poland and all the Baltic States, and signed a non aggression pact with Germany, handing over mainland Europe to Hitler

          2) UK was not some little desperate island as is often depicted. Though waning, it was the premiere empire in the world at the time, with control of the seas. An invasion of England had very little chance of succeeding. Hitler wanted peace but it got rejected.

          3) Once Japan attacked the USA, the USA relieved the USSR of its eastern flank, letting it free up its best troops and its best general. This point is the most understated of all and is forgotten.

          4) Strategic and terror carpet bombing effects are also understated. The often cited statistic is that Germany's wartime production by tonnage actually increased as the war went on. This is a failed logic for the following reasons:
          * Anyone who knows anything about supply chain knows:
          ** The difference between gross and net. Maybe I supply you 50,000 tons more gear than I did last year, but if it gets blown up in transit, it's just as useless
          ** Disruption. Shortages of key material can delay and even cripple manufacturing.
          ** Diversion of material. If I have to spend all my resources building bunkers and moving stuff, that's less time I have to spend actually making it.
          ** Germany only switched to a total war production footing late in the game. Hitler correctly understood the home front could be demoralized by asking them for sacrifices (just as in WW1), but incorrectly implemented a home front production strategy.

          * Diversion of air cover. Soviets relied on huge overwhelming tank formations. Germany had to redirect alot of resources towards civilian protection, this strained the Luftwaffe, which could have left those huge tank formations stuck in a stalemate and dragged on the war indefinitely.

          5) Poland and France ate up a ton of German resources, and their partisan resistors were key in harassing occupation forces and providing manpower

          6) Soviet doctrine is to blame for the huge numbers of casualties suffered. Instead of using tactical withdrawal to save millions of troops, they were given stupid orders to stand their ground and let themselves get encircled. This did not delay Germany. If anything, it sped it up. So yes, there's huge numbers of casualties, but that's to blame on Stalin himself. Zhukov is on record several times stating he did not agree with the human wave tactics and they were useless.

          The REAL unsung heroes of WW2 were the Nationalist Chinese.
          American idiotism and ignorance has no limits.

          A f*cking imbeciles! (c.)

          Comment


          • #7
            Originally posted by giblets View Post
            They make it sound like the Russians did 99% of the fighting in Europe when it was really just 90%.
            More like 75% to be exact.

            Comment


            • #8
              Because of Russians we are free.
              Americans and british were/are just like the nazis

              Comment


              • #9
                Ok that's unfair.
                But in truth Russians crushed the german nazis.

                Americans and british are gays

                and greeks and serbians were the ones that really fought under occupation.

                polish and lithuanians got frecked.

                and french capitulated.

                still brits are more nazis than french


                In a nutshell, communists all over europe beat the nazis. the anglosaxon was the nazi

                Comment


                • #10
                  The FACT that the US has indeed flooded the world with media doesn't mean that anyone actually belives them. Especially when they were on the scene actually

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    I was watching a film about some britoamerican anglonazis trying not to kill some muslim girl in a bombing or something?

                    It was so immensly cringe worthy....

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      anglosaxon media is a goebbels noone actually believes

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        but just like brazilian soap operas it's cheap content. It's a free market economy

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          our ****ing nazi/clown prime minister didn't dare to say that the frecking RED ARMY liberated auswich and used an archaic greek word for "red".

                          That's the idiocy, the nazism we had to endure abd overcome from the frecking nazis and the anglosaxon nazis and all kinds of nazis.
                          The greek communists beat the nazis and then the angloamerican fascists put those defeated nazis in power.

                          The ****ing germanonazi asskisser collaborator didn't have the GUTS to just say the truth: The RED army, the communists, just as half of Greece is, liberated auswich

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            our clown lower than the sewers right wing piece of sh!t corrupted incompetent son of a b!tch prime minister quivers in front of the strength and integrity of ideals of the left wing that like a tsunami will drawn in RED BLOOD (ideological) their clown of a government

                            very soon

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