Help Elok understand the ongoing Russia ... thingy

[Dinner]

Wrong thread.

[Dinner]

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/22/russiagate-skeptic-backtalk-217072

For Elok to read.

[Wezil]

I'm just glad the middle east has settled down for a period of peace and tranquility now that the troublemaker Saddam is gone.

[spambot]

Just kill the troublemaker Assad an everything will be fine

[Aeson]

32 count indictment for Gates and Manafort. Gates pleads guilty. Gates cooperating with the investigation leading to 5 additional indictments of Manafort. Nothing to see here!

[Wezil]

Manafort better hope he has something to offer Mueller.

Otherwise he'll die in prison.

[Dinner]

He is likely hoping if he keeps his mouth shut Trump will give him a pardon.

[pchang]

Trump and his lawyers are most likely trying to figure out how to give him a pardon without also obstructing justice.

[Wiglaf]

There is pretty solid evidence that Trump fired or has sought to fire everyone in the DOJ that has sought to investigate whether there was collusion between his campaign and Russia. This would clearly be Obstruction of Justice.

CLEAR A PATH FOR JON MILLER, LEGAL SCHOLAR (AND INVENTER OF FACTS)

TWO THINGS HOTSHOT


(2) TRUMP HAS NOT FIRED THE GUY WHO APPOINTED MUELLER, AND WHO HAS THE ABILITY TO FIRE MUELLER AT ANY TIME, SO YOUR STATEMENT IS CLEARLY, SO OBVIOUSLY FACTUALLY FALSE LOOK UP 'ROD ROSENSTEIN' AND CHECK YOUR FACTS **BEFORE** POSTING

(1) PRESIDENT CAN FIRE ANY SENIOR APPOINTTEE IN THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH -- THEY WORK FOR HIM -- FOR ANY REASON. SEE THE WRITINGS OF THE NOTED HARVARD JEW EMERITUS ALAN DERSHOWITZ. PRESIDENT CAN ALSO DIRECT INVESTIGATIVE BODIES TO INVESTIGATE WHAT HE WANTS THEM TO BECAUSE, UNDER THE CONSTITUTION, THEY WORK FOR HIM. IS IT OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE FOR OBAMA TO SAY, LET'S STOP FOCUSING INVESTIGATIONS ON ILLEGALS, AND PUT RESOURCES INTO GUN OWNERS? NO. A LEGAL ACT DOES NOT BECOME OBSTRUCTION BECAUSE IT MIGHT BENEFIT THE PERSON GIVING THE ORDER. OR MAYBE READ THE FEDERAL OBSTRUCTION STATUTES AND GET BACK TO ME -- THEY DON'T COVER THIS. (AND IT WOULD BE A CONSTITUTIONAL CRISIS IF THEY DID)


OR STICK TO PHYSICS *******

[Wiglaf]

SORRY FORGOT TO SIGN MY POST LIKE JON SO YOU KNOW WHO WROTE IT

-WIGLAF

----
WIGLAF


----WIGLAF

[Wiglaf]

Trump and his lawyers are most likely trying to figure out how to give him a pardon without also obstructing justice.

GOOD THING PARDONING CANNOT EVER BE OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE

DO YOU PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTAND THIS

PARDON POWER IS IN THE CONSTITUTION, AND IT IS VERY CLEAR THAT IT'S A PLENARY POWER

FEDERAL OBSTRUCTION LAWS ARE NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION

CONSTITUTION SUPERSEDES FEDERAL OBSTRUCTION LAWS ANYWAY, EVEN IF THERE WAS A CONFLICT

DO YOU PEOPLE MOUTH OFF ABOUT MEDICAL **** WITHOUT BEING DOCTORS? NO?

THEN STOP MOUTHING OFF ABOUT LEGAL **** WITHOUT BE ING LAWYERS

mA:dm :AdA:LD

GUESS WHAT ELSE IS IN THE CONSTITUTION? THE IDEA THAT THE EXECUTIVE (PRESIDENT) ****IN DOMINATES THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH (HIS APPOINTEES) AND CAN DIRECT IT WITHOUT LEGAL INQUIRY INTO ALL HIS MOTIVATIONS FOR PERSONNELL MOVES

[Aeson]

IS IT OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE FOR OBAMA TO SAY, LET'S STOP FOCUSING INVESTIGATIONS ON ILLEGALS, AND PUT RESOURCES INTO GUN OWNERS?

What if Obama was an illegal immigrant though?

[Wiglaf]

What if Obama was an illegal immigrant though?

NO OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE IS NOT A LOOSEY-GOOSEY AMBIGUOUS THING THAT APPLIES WHENEVER YOU THINK SOMEONE IS DOING SOMETHING UNJUST OR THAT BENEFITS THEM.

IT'S DEFINED BY FEDERAL LAW IN VARIOUS WAYS ALL LISTED HERE, https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/t...t-I/chapter-73

1510 (CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION OBSTRUCTION) DOES NOT FIT AT ALL, AND I CAN'T FIND ANY OTHER ONE THAT MIGHT FIT. CAN YOU?

THE CRIMINAL OBSTRUCTION STATUTES REFER TO OBSTRUCTING AN OFFICIAL PROCEEDING (LIKE BRIBING A WITNESS, OR DESTROYING EVIDENCE BEFORE TRIAL). THAT HAS NOT HAPPENED BY FIRING AN OFFICIAL DOING THE INVESTIGATING (WHICH IS NOT AN "OFFICIAL PROCEEDING" ANYWAYS -- LIKE A HEARING OR TRIAL)

IF YOU FIND ONE THAT WOULD FIT, LET ME KNOW, BECAUSE THERE ISN'T ONE.

ALSO HELPFUL

) The uniqueness of the president’s role creates a whole host of legal, constitutional, and political obstacles here.

2) Trump’s allegedly obstructive conduct doesn’t quite match the two presidential precedents we have here. The obstruction of justice impeachment articles Presidents Nixon and Clinton faced accused them of destroying or withholding evidence and telling witnesses to lie under oath.

3) Finally, Trump’s possible motive is more difficult to prove than many are acknowledging with the evidence we have so far. That’s because he can still make the case that rather than acting to cover up crimes, he acted because he genuinely believes the Russia investigation is “fake news” and that he did nothing wrong.

[Aeson]

If impersonating the president to fraudulently convince investigators to drop an investigation isn't obstruction of justice, it should be.

[BeBMan]

Maybe they settle for a compromise: Trump stays pres without any further investigation, but loses all his security clearances and twitter logins.