Sharia Law at Wal Mart [Trigger Warning: People Arguing With Ben]

[Ben Kenobi]

more than 200 years passed between those two events.

So you're saying that when Italian unification rolled around the Pope didn't have Parma? And that the Pope gave it away freely?

the french that he himself had called in the fight his italian enemies and would eventually be defeated by.

So he didn't invade Parma and steal the land from them, and liberated them from France.

[Proteus_MST]

I see you missed the reference to the Amalekites attempting to destroy the Israelites in the desert.

And this gives the israelites the right to commit a genocide of everyone, including children who were not even able to carry a weapon at this times and babies who still were sucking at their mothers breasts? And of livestock that didn´t have anything to do with the war at all but just was raised by the Amalekites to give milk and meat?

Hm ... maybe we should have implemented these morals on the napoleonic wars (for example) and slain every frenchman, and frenchwoman and french children and then (as germany, austria, GB and russia, divided the now depopulated french heartland among ourselves.

[C0ckney]

So you're saying that when Italian unification rolled around the Pope didn't have Parma? And that the Pope gave it away freely?

what does that have to do with anything? oh that's right, nothing.

So he didn't invade Parma and steal the land from them, and liberated them from France.

no, he annexed parma and piacenza and then created a duchy out of them for his illegitimate son. i've already told you this.

[Berzerker]

Cockney?

Then why are you responding to me about Comanches?

History would argue with you there.

History says the Romans weren't barbaric? So what? They were barbaric and they slaughtered Christians.

As for Jesus, where did he condemn a soldier? Did he tell the soldier that he needed to give up his job and follow him? Or did he actually say, "such faith I have not found in all of Israel."

So what I can conclude is that Jesus believed that soldiers made the best Christians.

You're talking about Jesus healing the Centurion's slave... He didn't say he was "fine" with being a Centurion, he was impressed by such a powerful man humbling himself before Jesus. Turning that into an endorsement of the military, the same military that executed Jesus, is illogical. I already explained where Jesus condemned being a soldier, the golden rule, not resisting evil-doers, forgiving trespassers, etc... You cant be a soldier and live by those standards. You're signing up to resist evil-doers and punish trespassers...and worse, kill innocent people too.

[N35t0r]

The Pope defeated France and liberated Parma.

Then in 1870, the Italians defeated the Pope and liberated Rome. Hell, even the romans were in favour of unifying with Italy.

[Ben Kenobi]

You're talking about Jesus healing the Centurion's slave... He didn't say he was "fine" with being a Centurion, he was impressed by such a powerful man humbling himself before Jesus. Turning that into an endorsement of the military, the same military that executed Jesus, is illogical. I already explained where Jesus condemned being a soldier, the golden rule, not resisting evil-doers, forgiving trespassers, etc... You cant be a soldier and live by those standards. You're signing up to resist evil-doers and punish trespassers.

Jesus himself said, "such faith I have not found in all Israel". You asked me where he praises soldiers. There you go.

[Ben Kenobi]

Then in 1870, the Italians defeated the Pope and liberated Rome. Hell, even the romans were in favour of unifying with Italy.

And 60 years later they paid the Pope for most of his land and gave him the Vatican back. It was never about freedom it was just about crushing dissent.

[Berzerker]

Jesus himself said, "such faith I have not found in all Israel". You asked me where he praises soldiers. There you go.

He didn't praise soldiers, he praised the Centurion for humbling himself before Jesus.

[Ben Kenobi]

He didn't praise soldiers, he praised the Centurion for humbling himself before Jesus.

Last I checked the Centurion was a soldier. And Jesus praised him.

[Ben Kenobi]

And this gives the israelites the right to commit a genocide of everyone, including children who were not even able to carry a weapon at this times and babies who still were sucking at their mothers breasts? And of livestock that didn´t have anything to do with the war at all but just was raised by the Amalekites to give milk and meat?

What do you think the Amalekites were doing? Do you think they were trying to spare Israel by attacking them in the desert? Maybe they were inviting them over for Pinochle?

[N35t0r]

And 60 years later they paid the Pope for most of his land and gave him the Vatican back. It was never about freedom it was just about crushing dissent.

Not they, Mussolini did. He didn't make a plebiscite.

[Berzerker]

The Faith of the Centurion

1When Jesus had finished saying all this to the people who were listening, he entered Capernaum. 2There a centurion’s servant, whom his master valued highly, was sick and about to die. 3The centurion heard of Jesus and sent some elders of the Jews to him, asking him to come and heal his servant. 4When they came to Jesus, they pleaded earnestly with him, “This man deserves to have you do this, 5because he loves our nation and has built our synagogue.” 6So Jesus went with them.

He was not far from the house when the centurion sent friends to say to him: “Lord, don’t trouble yourself, for I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. 7That is why I did not even consider myself worthy to come to you. But say the word, and my servant will be healed. 8For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.”

9When Jesus heard this, he was amazed at him, and turning to the crowd following him, he said, “I tell you, I have not found such great faith even in Israel.” 10Then the men who had been sent returned to the house and found the servant well.

Nothing in there about Jesus praising the Centurion for being a soldier

[Ben Kenobi]

Mussolini did. He didn't make a plebiscite.

Do you think the Pope's rightful repayment for his land should have been subject to a plebescite? Repayment I might add that the liberals already agreed should occur?

I think that Mussolini did the right thing by doing what the liberals didn't have the heart to do - and give the Pope his rightful sovereignty back. In this sense, Mussolini, the hated Fascist was more liberal than the purported 'liberals'.

[Berzerker]

What do you think the Amalekites were doing? Do you think they were trying to spare Israel by attacking them in the desert? Maybe they were inviting them over for Pinochle?

well there ya go, do to others before they will do unto you

[N35t0r]

Do you think the Pope's rightful repayment for his land should have been subject to a plebescite? Repayment I might add that the liberals already agreed should occur?

I think that Mussolini did the right thing by doing what the liberals didn't have the heart to do - and give the Pope his rightful sovereignty back. In this sense, Mussolini, the hated Fascist was more liberal than the purported 'liberals'.

So it's not about freedom, it's about it being OK for the pope to conquer when he's got the upper hand, but when he doesn't, it's an outrage that other people do the same to him?