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Canadians, The National Post is satire, right?

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  • Canadians, The National Post is satire, right?



    SIX NATIONS, Ont. — * For Laurie Hill, resident of Canada’s largest aboriginal community, it’s just wrong to suggest that modern medicine is the only way to treat cancer and other serious diseases.

    She stands firmly behind the Six Nations neighbours who took their 11-year-old daughter with leukemia out of chemotherapy, and are treating her with traditional, but unproven, native methods and other alternative health-care instead.

    “There’s a fear of [aboriginal remedies] or denial of it. If things can’t be quantified or qualified, to them it’s irrelevant,” said Ms. Hill, as she shopped at Ancestral Voices Healing Centre Thursday. “Who are they [doctors] to say she will make it with their treatments. Just because they have a degree, that makes them more knowledgeable?”

    Her perspective on what seems to be a widening cultural divide received some recognition from a surprising quarter Thursday: *the judge deciding whether the cancer-stricken girl should be forced back into chemotherapy.

    As an extraordinary court case in nearby Brantford moved toward an end, a lawyer for McMaster Children’s Hospital argued that child-welfare authorities should have used their power to require the young woman to stay in treatment. With chemo, childhood leukemia now has a survival rate in the range of 90%, and remains a likely death sentence without it, experts say.
    Related

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    But Justice Gethin Edward of the Ontario Court of Justice suggested physicians essentially want to “impose our world view on First Nation culture.” The idea of a cancer treatment being judged on the basis of statistics that quantify patients’ five-year survival rate is “completely foreign” to aboriginal ways, he said.

    “Even if we say there is not one child who has been cured of acute lymphoblastic leukemia by traditional methods, is that a reason to invoke child protection?” asked Justice Edward, noting that the girl’s mother believes she is doing what is best for her daughter.

    “Are we to second guess her and say ‘You know what, we don’t care?’ … Maybe First Nations culture doesn’t require every child to be treated with chemotherapy and to survive for that culture to have value.”

    Daphne Jarvis, lawyer for McMaster Children’s Hospital in Hamilton, replied that the girl’s mother had made it clear she wants her child to be cured, and yet no evidence * — either empirical or “experiential” — was entered in the court hearing that traditional methods successfully treat childhood leukemia.

    In fact, doctors testified that another 11-year-old First Nations girl with cancer who dropped out of chemo at the same hospital earlier this year has now relapsed, said the lawyer.

    “That is clear and unequivocal,” she said.

    The girl in the latest case, whose identity is subject to a court-ordered publication ban, has spent the last several weeks in a Florida alternative-health centre, she and her parents deciding she had had enough of chemotherapy after 10 days of the treatment.

    The hospital called on Brant Child and Family Services, which investigated and eventually decided it would not intervene, saying the case was a matter of health-care consent, not child protection.

    McMaster Children’s then took the unusual step of asking a judge to force the agency to get the child back into chemo. The hearing has taken place sporadically over the last month, and is expected to conclude next Wednesday.

    Ms. Jarvis conceded that the province’s Health Care Consent Act allows a patient of any age to potentially be capable of agreeing, or not, to treatment. In this case, though, it was clear to doctors that the girl was a typical 11-year-old and not sophisticated enough to make such a life-and-death decision.

    When the parents then refused to keep her in chemo, it became a child-welfare matter, the lawyer said.

    But Mark Handelman, the children’s aid society’s lawyer, said later that doctors did not properly determine if the girl was capable of giving or denying consent, as required by the health consent law.

    “The girl didn’t even get a fair trial,” he said. “None of her rights under the Act were respected.”

    Even if the hospital had determined she was too young to decide, they should have gone to Ontario’s Consent and Capacity Board to resolve the dispute, he said.

    Back at Six Nations, meanwhile, Ancestral Voices employee Hayley Doxtater said aboriginal remedies are becoming increasingly popular. She pointed to a cancer treatment — a collection of herbs including slippery elm and turkey rhubarb root * — that she said one customer has repeatedly traveled an hour from Toronto to buy for a sick friend.

    “We have people come in here who are so happy that something works,” she said. “They’ll say ‘That stuff is amazing.’ “


    Right?
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    "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

  • #2
    It's not the National Post that's the problem....

    This is not an uncommon attitude in Canada, fwiw.
    Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
    "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
    2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

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    • #3
      I don't understand why Canada continues to subsidize the **** out of eskimo communities hundreds of miles from ****ing anything that produce nothing of value. They would be so much better off if they lived in some place that wasn't an icy inhospitable wasteland.

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      • #4
        Throw the parents in jail for child endangerment.
        Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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        • #5
          No one wants to side with the First Nation people here? Maybe fakeboris? Bueller?
          Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
          "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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          • #6
            I don't understand why Canada continues to subsidize the **** out of eskimo communities hundreds of miles from ****ing anything that produce nothing of value. They would be so much better off if they lived in some place that wasn't an icy inhospitable wasteland.
            Because it's seen as less racist to condemn them to a life of poverty, alcohol abuse and huffing.
            Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
            "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
            2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

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            • #7
              First they came for the eleven-year-old cancer patients with luddite parents, and I did not speak up, becaus--

              No, wait, that would be stupid, and so is this. Sorry, no argument here.
              1011 1100
              Pyrebound--a free online serial fantasy novel

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              • #8
                Originally posted by regexcellent View Post
                I don't understand why Canada continues to subsidize the **** out of eskimo communities hundreds of miles from ****ing anything that produce nothing of value. They would be so much better off if they lived in some place that wasn't an icy inhospitable wasteland.
                Does Nunavut maybe produce tourism money, or carved Inuit tchotchkes that can be sold to unwashed hippies from Oregon for hundreds of dollars above material and labor costs?
                1011 1100
                Pyrebound--a free online serial fantasy novel

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                • #9
                  I suppose I could try playing a limited devil's advocate here. Perhaps the ma saw her daughter getting ill from the chemo, wouldn't listen to doctors telling her that's normal, and decided her angel was going back to the slippery elm and turkey rhubarb, whatever the hell that is?
                  1011 1100
                  Pyrebound--a free online serial fantasy novel

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                  • #10
                    Does Nunavut maybe produce tourism money, or carved Inuit tchotchkes that can be sold to unwashed hippies from Oregon for hundreds of dollars above material and labor costs?
                    Nunavut has substantial natural resources that aren't being exploited because of stuff like this. Is the population sparse? Sure, but it doesn't mean there aren't significant natural resources. The biggest problem is transportation.

                    Canada doesn't even have a road that connects with the arctic, least of all something that connects up with Nunavut. Nearest railroad station is in Churchill, Manitoba, some 4k, 5k miles from the capital.
                    Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                    "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                    2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I may have let my daughter die of a horrible, treatable cancer, but at least she didn't have any side effects! (Thanks for the pity posts, Elok.)
                      Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                      "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Elok View Post
                        Does Nunavut maybe produce tourism money, or carved Inuit tchotchkes that can be sold to unwashed hippies from Oregon for hundreds of dollars above material and labor costs?
                        I'm sure they do but it would appear the market for kitschy tourist crap isn't enough to support the economy.

                        Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
                        Nunavut has substantial natural resources that aren't being exploited because of stuff like this. Is the population sparse? Sure, but it doesn't mean there aren't significant natural resources. The biggest problem is transportation.

                        Canada doesn't even have a road that connects with the arctic, least of all something that connects up with Nunavut. Nearest railroad station is in Churchill, Manitoba, some 4k, 5k miles from the capital.
                        Seeing as the capital of Nunavut is on a ****ing island a railroad would be a hell of a feat.

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                        • #13
                          Remember this?
                          No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

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                          • #14
                            Think of it as evolution in action.
                            Libraries are state sanctioned, so they're technically engaged in privateering. - Felch
                            I thought we're trying to have a serious discussion? It says serious in the thread title!- Al. B. Sure

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
                              Nunavut has substantial natural resources that aren't being exploited because of stuff like this. Is the population sparse? Sure, but it doesn't mean there aren't significant natural resources. The biggest problem is transportation.

                              Canada doesn't even have a road that connects with the arctic, least of all something that connects up with Nunavut. Nearest railroad station is in Churchill, Manitoba, some 4k, 5k miles from the capital.
                              ****, if we had to wait for you lazy canucks there still wouldn't be a road to Alaska. During WW2 the Americans had to pay to have it built.
                              Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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