Bradley Manning wants to be a woman

[Hauldren Collider]

Man, are you really so lacking in self awareness that you cant see how analogous this is to people accepting gays. Based on your own morals, worldview, etc etc this something is very taboo to the point that you dismiss it wholesale as being possible or real.

Your attitude towards things move at a glacial pace. I highly doubt you dont accept homosexuality as strongly as transgender.

Homosexuality doesn't indicate surgery. Or medication.

[MRT144]

Homosexuality doesn't indicate surgery. Or medication.

Why is that the line for you?

[DaShi]

Can't we go like, two weeks without another thread arguing about transwhatsits?

This is a very important issue for some people.

[giblets]

Homosexuality doesn't indicate surgery. Or medication.

Every woman who gets breast implants or a breast size reduction because she's not happy with her body is mentally ill then?

[Hauldren Collider]

Why is that the line for you?

It changes it from being just different to being an actual disorder.

[Hauldren Collider]

Every woman who gets breast implants or a breast size reduction because she's not happy with her body is mentally ill then?

1. That's cosmetic surgery. The sex change surgery, while also elective, is intended to improve mental health.

2. Breast surgery isn't motivated by some delusional (yes, literally delusional) belief that you are something when you are not.

[giblets]

1. That's cosmetic surgery. The sex change surgery, while also elective, is intended to improve mental health.

2. It isn't out of some delusional (yes, literally delusional) belief that you are something when you are not.

How is "I have small/large breasts and would like to change that" not delusional while "I have a penis/vagina and would like to change that" is?

[MRT144]

It changes it from being just different to being an actual disorder.

Based on what rationale?

Also, since you are holding the position that is opposite what the field of psychology is saying is a pretty valid thing, does this basically sour you on all psychology or just people who disagree with your esoteric belief that body modification/mutilation as a means of achieving sound mental health is unnacceptable under any condition.

Are you basically saying that people who feel this way are mentally ill? And if so, why isn't body modification on the table as a form of treatment? I mean, its kind of astounding that you have such an entrenched belief in something that you obviously havent pondered very much at all.

[ZEE]

Brilliant that he is going for the chick prison then.

I thought this was his Plan as well.

[Elok]

This is a very important issue for some people.

Yeah, they're called transsexuals. Or transgender, or something. AFAIK we don't have any. Don't know what the deal is with everyone else.

[Elok]

Oh, and technically being trans is not delusional. They're aware that they are not physically women in any sense, they just feel a compulsion to become one. If you're going to use psych jargon, I think neurosis or obsession or something would be more accurate. Anyway, if they're mentally ill, compassion is in order. Mental illness is still illness, and as this particular illness apparently cannot be cured, it seems more compassionate to let them mutilate than to force them to continue on hating their bodies. Playing along with the craziness doesn't cost us anything.

[MRT144]

Oh, and technically being trans is not delusional. They're aware that they are not physically women in any sense, they just feel a compulsion to become one. If you're going to use psych jargon, I think neurosis or obsession or something would be more accurate. Anyway, if they're mentally ill, compassion is in order. Mental illness is still illness, and as this particular illness apparently cannot be cured, it seems more compassionate to let them mutilate than to force them to continue on hating their bodies. Playing along with the craziness doesn't cost us anything.

You are presenting obviously the most compassionate while still disbelieving in the whole shebang POV but man, this philosophy could go a long way so many times. Being put out by things that literally doesnt do anything than offend your sensibilities sucks.

[Alexander's Horse]

there was obviously a major failure of security screening with this guy/girl

[Elok]

You are presenting obviously the most compassionate while still disbelieving in the whole shebang POV but man, this philosophy could go a long way so many times. Being put out by things that literally doesnt do anything than offend your sensibilities sucks.

I'm not put out by it--I've run into maybe two or three trans people in my life, that I know of, so it's pretty well a non-issue--but if, every time you take off your clothes, you look down at your genitals and feel horror, revulsion, shame or sadness, it is (the way I see it) perfectly clear that something has gone badly awry. If body and mind disagree, at least one has to be wrong. In at least some of these cases--I don't know how it breaks down, percentage-wise--it turns out that the sex chromosomes are totally bonkers, even to the point of different cells in the same person disagreeing. In others, everything checks out genetically and, uh, genitally, which by process of elimination means the error is all upstairs. I say this not out of hatred but as a plain statement of the facts as I perceive them.

I've become more tolerant on the matter over the years, but the problem here, for me, is not that they are not ill at all but that we regard the ill with loathing or contempt.

[notyoueither]

It is no longer considered a mental illness, at all.

Even if chromosomes are... correct for the sex of a person the brain function may be very different from people who do not have the condition.