WH on NSA snooping: You can totally trust us.

[Sava]

You just want the terrists to win

[The Mad Monk]

[Wezil]

Occupy was not an organization comprised solely of anarchists and hippies. Do you really think there are that many anarchists and hippies in the US?

The ones camping in the parks were (at the three locations I saw anyway).

People with jobs had other things to do.

[regexcellent]

The crowds got a lot thinner around midterm time.

Occupy Rochester was ~30 people downtown. They got kicked out pretty fast. I'm embarrassed to say that I actually know someone who went camping there.

[Colonâ„¢]

Snowden you little *****.

[Colonâ„¢]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23021767

The US intelligence fugitive Edward Snowden has arrived in Moscow on a flight from Hong Kong.

But he is only thought to be in transit before leaving for Venezuela or Ecuador, via Cuba.

Does he really believe he's advancing the cause of liberty and democracry by fleeing from one authoritharian regime to another? He hasn't been charged with treason and his life isn't at stake. Every bit the self-righteous drama queen that Assange is.

[kentonio]

If he ends up in US hands he's almost certainly facing spending the next 30 years in federal prison. He's fleeing to countries that won't extradite him, and yes that means countries that don't like the US that much. What exactly has this guy done wrong that makes him a 'self-righteous turd'?

[Colonâ„¢]

The guy did commit a crime you know. It's just not in his place to judge whether documents can be declassified. Even if he doesn't deserve punishment for revealing the existence of PRISM and the like, he can in all be fairness be punished for revealing spy operations overseas.

Besides, the guy claimed he fled to HK because of its strong record in free speech (what that has got to do with anything beats me, but anyhow) and this is what HRW has to say about Ecuador:

"President Rafael Correa has undercut freedom of the press in Ecuador by subjecting journalists and media figures to public denunciation and retaliatory litigation. Judicial independence continues to suffer due to transitional mechanisms for judicial reform that have given the government and its supporters in Congress a powerful say in appointing and dismissing judges."

Real consistent that. He claims he's defending liberty, but he's not going to achieve that by giving moral points to countries that undercut civil rights far more than the US.

[DinoDoc]

and yes that means countries that don't like the US that much.

This seems to require he has something to trade for protection other than being a walking PSA for the dangers of a Surveillance State.

[kentonio]

The guy did commit a crime you know. It's just not in his place to judge whether documents can be declassified. Even if he doesn't deserve punishment for revealing the existence of PRISM and the like, he can in all be fairness be punished for revealing spy operations overseas.

If you deny people protection when they reveal things that offend their conscious, then you don't get to control exactly what else they reveal. If the US had managed the reveal without just threatening to lock him up for the rest of his adult life, a lot of this could have been avoided.

Besides, the guy claimed he fled to HK because of its strong record in free speech (what that has got to do with anything beats me, but anyhow) and this is what HRW has to say about Ecuador:

"President Rafael Correa has undercut freedom of the press in Ecuador by subjecting journalists and media figures to public denunciation and retaliatory litigation. Judicial independence continues to suffer due to transitional mechanisms for judicial reform that have given the government and its supporters in Congress a powerful say in appointing and dismissing judges."

Real consistent that. He claims he's defending liberty, but he's not going to achieve that by giving moral points to countries that undercut civil rights far more than the US.

So the US can do what they like, because we should just assume they are more morally right than their enemies? The US lecture the Chinese on hacking, and then complain because someone points out it was happening the other way too? Seriously?

Snowden went public because he felt he had to, and now has to deal with the consequences of spending the rest of his life running in fear from the worlds superpower. He doesn't exactly have a lot of options unless he wants to stare at a cell wall forever, and we're supposed to think badly of him because his destination might not be the best country on the planet?

[kentonio]

This seems to require he has something to trade for protection other than being a walking PSA for the dangers of a Surveillance State.

Most of America's enemies would give him sanctuary just to piss you off.

[Colonâ„¢]

The US is more morally right than countries like Ecuador.

[DinoDoc]

Most of America's enemies would give him sanctuary just to piss you off.

I think you overestimate the stupidity of our enemies. Most of them seem to have an emotional maturity greater than a 7 year old.

[kentonio]

The US is more morally right than countries like Ecuador.

On many things sure, but it's more than a little naive to have complete faith that any country will just always do the right thing... because? We know of many terrible things that the US has done in the past, from attempted assassinations of foreign leaders, to overthrowing democratically elected governments, to conducting secret medical experiments on its own minority citizens and much much more.

Now we know that the US is conducting vast surveillance operations without the slightest care about the privacy and rights of the vast majority of people who don't live in America, and not much more care about American citizens either. Yet we're supposed to just smile and trust Uncle Sam to have our best interests at heart?

[kentonio]

DP