Will the real Christians like Father Michael Ryan please stand up?

[Wezil]

Go non-violent then.

Surely enough of the anti-baby killing crowd can overwhelm the system with civil disobedience to have an effect. If baby killing can't get you motivated nothing will.

Your arrest won't be in vain Jon.

[Jon Miller]

How would it not be in vain?

Other than to take away my voice and to put me in a place I can do no good at all for the next XX years, what would it do? Other than saying 'civil disobedience' you haven't made a point about anything. One person being 'civil disobedient' and doing nothing other than going to jail is nothing other than a loss of that one person. Even 100, this would mostly be true.

Actually, saying 'murderers' isn't generally the best tactic either. The best tactic is probably some combination of reason (with the facts of brain waves/etc) in addition to sediment (pictures of the babies at 32 weeks/etc).

JM
(100 000 burning themselves in front of abortion clinics would probably do something, but that is not really a Christian thing ( and is violent/etc) )

[Jon Miller]

I don't think you believe that those who are against abortion are rational. Or else you don't believe that non-violent actions are rational.

JM

[Wezil]

How would it not be in vain?

Other than to take away my voice and to put me in a place I can do no good at all for the next XX years, what would it do? Other than saying 'civil disobedience' you haven't made a point about anything. One person being 'civil disobedient' and doing nothing other than going to jail is nothing other than a loss of that one person. Even 100, this would mostly be true.

Actually, saying 'murderers' isn't generally the best tactic either. The best tactic is probably some combination of reason (with the facts of brain waves/etc) in addition to sediment (pictures of the babies at 32 weeks/etc).

JM
(100 000 burning themselves in front of abortion clinics would probably do something, but that is not really a Christian thing ( and is violent/etc) )

100,000 people getting arrested on the same day sure as hell would have an effect.

In a nation of 300+ million you can't get 100,000 people motivated enough over the "killing" (your word) of innocent babies to commit civil disobedience? Do you not really believe what you say or are babies just not important enough? I'd have no problem getting a bunch of people together to do what we could (including arrest at a minimum) to bring that to an end.

[Al B. Sure!]

If the history of the world will teach you anything, the murders of vast numbers of people alone don't get people in an uproar. It takes more than just the deaths of millions of innocents, especially when the murderers number in the millions and are all around us.

[Wezil]

I don't think you believe that those who are against abortion are rational. Or else you don't believe that non-violent actions are rational.

JM

No, I think you don't believe it is the killing of babies. If you did your opposition would be much more forceful.

Either that or you are a coward. You really do believe it is the killing of babies but you just aren't prepared to make any sort of meaningful sacrifice to stop it. You'll sound all moral and righteous on an internet forum and send a donation to your favourite pro-life organisation (as if you are fighting breast cancer or something) but you won't really stand up and say "NO!" when it comes to the killing of a million babies a year in your midst.

[Jon Miller]

I would definitely take part in mass protests which had the risk of arrest and jail time. A hunger strike or something.

But yes, alby is right, when it is all around you it is hard to get people active about it, even if in their hearts they think it is monstrous. See the history of people everywhere.

JM

[Jon Miller]

No, I think you don't believe it is the killing of babies. If you did your opposition would be much more forceful.

Either that or you are a coward. You really do believe it is the killing of babies but you just aren't prepared to make any sort of meaningful sacrifice to stop it. You'll sound all moral and righteous on an internet forum and send a donation to your favourite pro-life organisation (as if you are fighting breast cancer or something) but you won't really stand up and say "NO!" when it comes to the killing of a million babies a year in your midst.

I think you are an ass.

JM

[Jon Miller]

People who are against abortion:

debate
write
protest
carry signs
vote
give money

They do a lot. They are not 'do nothings'.

It is similar to the amount that people did over the genocide in Rwanda/etc.

JM

[Wezil]

I think you are an ass.

JM

As I said when we started this - I don't think you have the courage of your convictions.

Tone down your rhetoric about the "killing" of babies when people mention abortion and I won't call you on it.

[Jon Miller]

No. You are an ass.

And those who support abortion support baby killing.

Just the facts.

If I could exchange my life to end all abortion in the US, I would do so.

It isn't possible to make the exchange. It is difficult to make the exchange of my life for just stopping one abortion.

JM

[Wezil]

People who are against abortion:

debate
write
protest
carry signs
vote
give money

They do a lot. They are not 'do nothings'.

It is similar to the amount that people did over the genocide in Rwanda/etc.

JM

Great, and how's that working out? It's coming up on 40 years since Roe v. Wade.

Quick math - 1,000,000 * 40 (and counting) = a ****load of dead babies.

Again, would you debate and write letters while millions of teenagers were being killed?

[Al B. Sure!]

Yes because violence sure is a great way to bring people to your cause. It's worked wonderfully for Al-Qaeda in pushing their agenda on America.

[Wezil]

Alright. I'll put Albie in the Stand By and Watch category.

I'd be in the get violent if necessary camp if my State were sanctioning the killing of a million babies a year (or any other innocents). There is some urgency to the problem.

[giblets]

No, I think you don't believe it is the killing of babies. If you did your opposition would be much more forceful.

Either that or you are a coward. You really do believe it is the killing of babies but you just aren't prepared to make any sort of meaningful sacrifice to stop it. You'll sound all moral and righteous on an internet forum and send a donation to your favourite pro-life organisation (as if you are fighting breast cancer or something) but you won't really stand up and say "NO!" when it comes to the killing of a million babies a year in your midst.

You're making a false dichotomy. He could simply be too selfish to make any major sacrifice for a good cause, but he'll happily do things that have a negligible cost (like complaining about it and voting).