Wisconsin Takes A Stand For Fiscal Sanity

[KrazyHorse]

In fairness to gribby he's being completely consistent; he wants both Democratic lawmakers and unionized public-sector employees to be overpaid and underworked at the expense of the taxpayer...

[Wezil]

Would the fairness extend to Republicans? If the R's suspended democracy would he be as supportive?

[Wezil]

Can someone explain why they actually left the State (rather than just not showing up for votes)?

I suspect there is a contempt issue at play here.

[Arrian]

Coupla things...

1) I love how contracts are sacred, unless they're with a union. Then they're an abomination that must be destroyed.

2) How does a public sector union "extort" from the government?

The fiscal situation is bad and something's gotta give. I'm amazed, however, at how cavalier most of you seem to be about telling a bunch of people "sorry, I know we promised you a bunch of stuff in a binding contract, but we didn't really mean it. Pound sand, suckers!"

-Arrian

[Wezil]

As I understand it you are misstating the facts. From the OP:

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Gov. Scott Walker unveiled sweeping legislation that would severely curtail public employee rights and dramatically change the way Wisconsin negotiates with unions going forward.

Officials alerted the Wisconsin State Employees Union on Friday that expired collective bargaining agreements would be canceled March 13
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You no longer have a contract when it expires (hence re-negotiating) so I fail to see what is being "destroyed". We aren't talking about "binding contracts" as you describe them.

I provided an answer to your other question early in the thread.

[Arrian]

As I understand it, an expired contract that is not replaced due to failure of negotations simply continues. To "cancel" it is new.

-Arrian

[The Mad Monk]

Can someone explain why they actually left the State (rather than just not showing up for votes)?

I suspect there is a contempt issue at play here.

The Sergeant-At-Arms is authorized to..."collect" errant legislators for a vote, and he can use the State Police to assist him in this endeavor.

[Donegeal]

They are just playing by the rules set up by the Wisconsin Constuition. They are playing the only card that Walker left them to play. I am proud of them for it, and I will support them come next election.

[Wezil]

As I understand it, an expired contract that is not replaced due to failure of negotations simply continues. To "cancel" it is new.

-Arrian

As with any expired contract, it may be canceled. There is absolutely nothing outrageous about that.

[Wezil]

They are just playing by the rules set up by the Wisconsin Constuition. They are playing the only card that Walker left them to play. I am proud of them for it, and I will support them come next election.

If the shoe was on the other foot? Will you support the Republicans suspending your legislature the next time a duly elected Democratic majority exercises powers within their legal rights?

If what the Republicans are proposing is illegal I presume the State courts can deal with it.

[Wezil]

I'm not a US'ian and if I was I sure as **** wouldn't be a Republican, but the idea that elected officials running from election results they don't like is an acceptable way to proceed is truly alarming.

[Arrian]

Ah, I see:

Government is a monopoly and when government workers strike the public has no alternative (competitor) to turn to. It provides undue leverage to the union that simply does not exist for unions in the private sector. Negotiations are never on a level playing field.

Setting aside the fact that this isn't 100% true, since it's mostly true, that seems like a fair point. Ok, but how does that translate into no unions allowed (or no striking, which to me reads like no union - why bother with a union if you can't threaten a strike?)? Isn't there a way to level the playing field for negotiations w/o removing the right to unionize?

-Arrian

[C0ckney]

it's a farce, and a very funny one at that.

edit: was responding to wezil.

[Donegeal]

Walker and his corparation croonies should have seen this coming and not gone so overboard with the bill. They knew what the numbers in the Senate were and they tried to push the issue.

And, Wezil, I'd like to point out that not only am I Republican, I am also in one of the unions Walker exempted in his bill, so I have very little to gain personally.

[Fake Boris]

In fairness to gribby he's being completely consistent; he wants both Democratic lawmakers and unionized public-sector employees to be overpaid and underworked at the expense of the taxpayer...

Hello. I'm still waiting for you to substantiate that claim.