16-Year-Old Sailor Feared Lost at Sea

[ColdWizard]

At least when 55 year olds get themselves killed they don't have their entire lives ahead of them.

But they've likely already passed on their faulty risk assessment genes on.

[Asher]

You value money, which is why you are *****ing about what they would spend to rescue her. If you spoke to the rescuers they think it's cool to pull this off.

Jesus ****ing christ.

I don't want millions of my dollars going to helping rescuers do cool ****.

You're a big government whore, Ben, and you just showed your true face.

Me, I value people.

If you valued people, you'd value their lives. If you'd value their lives, you'd be concerned when they propose doing something needlessly risky and stupid. They're free to do it, but you, as someone who values their life, should let them know you don't agree with risking their live for stupidity.

The fact that her stupidity cost American taxpayers money (I'm assuming the US will reimburse the nations involved in the search) is an auxiliary concern of mine.

If only everyone took her attitude, we'd have many fewer rescues, and people would be far more prepared before undertaking their quests.

If everyone took her attitude, we'd have far fewer people and the cost of rescuing all of them would be so astronomical the government would cease to fund it at all.

[Asher]

The parents need to be billed for the dispatch of ships and aircraft.

Right on.

She took a stupid, personal risk. She can pay the stupid, personal consequences out of her or her family's stupid, personal bank account.

If Ben's beliefs about small government and fiscal responsibility were consistent, he'd see how stupid it is for the general public to subsidize the stupidity of a single person.

[Ben Kenobi]

I don't want millions of my dollars going to helping rescuers do cool ****.

Well that's a difference between you and me. I think she's worth that cool million dollars. If that makes me a 'big government' person, then fine.

You're a big government whore, Ben, and you just showed your true face.

I value people over money. That's the difference, Asher. I can think of plenty of worse things that we spend money on. Do you know how much 1 million dollars is to the budget of Australia?

If you valued people, you'd value their lives. If you'd value their lives, you'd be concerned when they propose doing something needlessly risky and stupid.

I am concerned, but given that their son made the exact same trip successfully, shows me that the family knows how to do it right. Is it risky? Sure. Is it needless? No. I think it's an accomplishment. The role of the government is to stay the hell out of the decision. If the government told people what they could and could not do, nothing would ever get done.

They're free to do it, but you, as someone who values their life, should let them know you don't agree with risking their live for stupidity.

I think they are taking adequate precautions and preparations. And I've been proven right as this girl is going to be fine.

The fact that her stupidity cost American taxpayers money (I'm assuming the US will reimburse the nations involved in the search) is an auxiliary concern of mine.

Let me put it this way, Asher. If they chose not to rescue her, what kind of message would that send? I sure wouldn't want to pay taxes to a nation that valued money over people.

If everyone took her attitude, we'd have far fewer people and the cost of rescuing all of them would be so astronomical the government would cease to fund it at all.

So we should all stay inside and wrap ourselves in bubble wrap and never take risks? Bull****.

[Ben Kenobi]

If Ben's beliefs about small government and fiscal responsibility were consistent, he'd see how stupid it is for the general public to subsidize the stupidity of a single person.

Let me ask you a question.

If this were coming out of your own pocket, would you let the girl die or would you do what you could to rescue her? Yes or no?

[Asher]

Well that's a difference between you and me.

Yes, I believe in fiscal responsibility and the government to stay out of the lives of citizens.

You believe the government should actively subsidize people.

I value people over money.

Socialist.

I am concerned, but given that their son made the exact same trip successfully, shows me that the family knows how to do it right.

The fact that they got lucky once doesn't make it a good decision.

If the government told people what they could and could not do, nothing would ever get done.

Strawman -- no one is saying the government should forbid her from doing it. Just that she was stupid for doing it, and her stupidity means she gets to pay for the results of her actions.

I think they are taking adequate precautions and preparations. And I've been proven right as this girl is going to be fine.

You were proven wrong -- experts said it was stupid to be in that part of the ocean at this time of year. Not adequate precautions and preparations. Stupidity.

If they chose not to rescue her, what kind of message would that send? I sure wouldn't want to pay taxes to a nation that valued money over people.

Another strawman. Never said not to rescue her. Rescue her, bill her the costs.

So we should all stay inside and wrap ourselves in bubble wrap and never take risks? Bull****.

Another strawman. Take the risks if you want, but pay the consequences when they fail. No government handouts for stupidity.

[Asher]

Let me ask you a question.

If this were coming out of your own pocket, would you let the girl die or would you do what you could to rescue her? Yes or no?

Would I pay a million dollars to save the life of a 16 year old girl who arbitrarily decided to sail through notoriously nasty seas, completely alone, solely for the selfish goal of one-upping her brother?

**** no.

[Ben Kenobi]

You were proven wrong -- experts said it was stupid to be in that part of the ocean at this time of year. Not adequate precautions and preparations. Stupidity.

And her mast snapped, and she's going to be ok, because her boat and because of her preparations.

If she died I would have agreed with you, but that's not the case here.

**** happens, Asher. You can prepare as best as you can and stuff can still happen.

[OzzyKP]

You guys are so ****ing stupid. Do we send a bill to everyone who is rescued while hiking? Or a bill to anyone in a car crash? Or a bill to multi-national corporations who befoul thousands of miles of ocean and shoreline (I sure hope so, but I won't count on it)?

But a 16 year old, oh noes! She must be PUNISHED for daring to go against everyone. How dare she try to achieve something!

How quickly you guys have switched from dancing on her grave to blaming her for being alive. Absolutely disgusting.

I'm so happy she is alive.

Jordan Romero - Alive and successful
Abby Sunderland - Alive and hopefully soon, successful
Jessica Watson - Alive and successful

Ben & Ozzy - 3
Anti-Youth crowd - 0

[Ben Kenobi]

Would I pay a million dollars to save the life of a 16 year old girl

**** no

And there you go. Thank you Asher.

[Asher]

You guys are so ****ing stupid. Do we send a bill to everyone who is rescued while hiking? Or a bill to anyone in a car crash? Or a bill to multi-national corporations who befoul thousands of miles of ocean and shoreline (I sure hope so, but I won't count on it)?

But a 16 year old, oh noes! She must be PUNISHED for daring to go against everyone. How dare she try to achieve something!

She can try, she just needs to pay when it fails. Personal responsibility, not a government one.

How quickly you guys have switched from dancing on her grave to blaming her for being alive. Absolutely disgusting.

No one danced on her grave. The only thing disgusting here is your behaviour to reframe the positions of others to serve a selfish political gain.

Many, many people think she was dumb for trying this and weren't surprised to hear it went badly. That's very different from dancing on her grave.

I accept your apology for misrepresenting the positions in this thread.

[Asher]

And there you go. Thank you Asher.

So you're telling me you are 100% supportive of massive government subsidies? Because you value people over money?

Logically, you also support the following:
1) 100% universal healthcare. For everything. Prescriptions, surgery, preventative care, etc.
2) Paying to feed 3 square meals a day to every single person in the country who is not making enough to pay for it
3) Paying for the retirement and care for people too old to work

Is that right? Or do you have specific support only to subsidize rich 16 year old girls doing stupid and arbitrary things for no apparent reason?

[Asher]

I like how two right-wing people here are slandering people who want people taking stupid personal risks to take personal responsibilities for it. Are you guys this dumb?

I'm not anti-youth. Her actions were stupid regardless of her age. Get off your ****ing one-trick pony, Ozzy. Perhaps you should get a real job while you're at it, you're too old to be a youth advocate.

[Ben Kenobi]

So you're telling me you are 100% supportive of massive government subsidies?

How is this million dollar rescue 'massive' wrt to the overall Australian budget?

Logically, you also support the following:
1) 100% universal healthcare. For everything. Prescriptions, surgery, preventative care, etc.

No, because privatised health care is more effective at taking care of people. You save more lives by switching to an overall privatised system.

2) Paying to feed 3 square meals a day to every single person in the country who is not making enough to pay for it

No, because there are people and organisations willing to do it for free. Soup kitchens and the like.

3) Paying for the retirement and care for people too old to work

They have a responsibility to save for their own retirement. Again, there are private businesses that are built for this specific purpose.

Is that right? Or do you have specific support only to subsidize rich 16 year old girls doing stupid and arbitrary things for no apparent reason?

Is there a private business that could rescue her without government support? Yes or no?

[Ben Kenobi]

I'm not anti-youth.

Saying that you'd leave her die is anti-youth.