Sex abuse scandal. Guess the religion?

[DinoDoc]

False. They would inform the other parish and they would assign him to duties where he would never have contact with children again.

Not entirely true. Though the Catholic Church is in good company when it comes to shuffling such people around Public Schools and the Boy Scouts apparently did as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parish_transfers_of_abusive_priests

[Asher]

Ben, two questions:

1) Do you honestly believe the **** you are saying? What you are saying is so out of touch with reality that you would truly be best served by checking yourself into a mental institution and have them check you out.
2) Are you trying to troll here? You could probably find funnier troll material than to make a mockery out of the MANY people who have been sexually abused. This is a huge deal, and for you to downplay it and absolve the people responsible for it is simply an act of an evil man. If I were a Christian man, I'd see if I'd get one of those exorcist dudes to go to work on you, because you are truly one evil, callous mother****er.

[Ben Kenobi]

Uhhhh... local laws were broken, so the STATE is the appropriate authority. If the priest violated specific laws of the Church that is religious in nature, sure, the Church has the right... but we are talking about child abuse here. We are talking felony charges here.

Name me an instance where the Church would have jurisdiction, in your eyes.

But I'll bet you it was close to 100% that the members of the new diocese weren't told that somebody else's child molesterer was being sent to them. And again, no notification was sent to the authorities.
The Church does NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over a US citizen being molested.

Neither does the State have the authority to arrest a priest based on hearsay. As for the other diocese, why would they have any contact with the priest at all? Remember no contact with kids.

What evidence that it didn't happen...

This is proving innocence. Not the problem. You have to establish guilt not the other way around. The default is that all the priests are innocent and the accusations are lies. You have to be able to prove that the priest was in fact responsible.

and your response is typical... not a reliable source in your opinion... Well, you don't consider anything that doesn't agree with your rose colored views to be a reliable source.

I don't consider Christopher Hitchens who, by his own admission, hates the church, to be a reliable source on the workings of the church. I do, for example. Consider the Monsignor of the affected diocese a reliable source becuase he was there, particularly when he admits that he screwed up wrt to his oversight. Rose coloured glasses? Haven't I said that people suck? I'm the least rose-coloured glassed person here. Everyone here seems to hang on every word of Christopher Hitchens as if it were Gospel, and I'm the only one questioning his account.

Yeah... great, for the ones that were actually brought to court and proven guilty, they finally respond like they should have FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.

Umm, they do this first, Ming, before it even goes out to the authorities. Remember your allegations of a cover up because they move the priests first? You might want to get your story straight here.

But, the fact that they didn't bring the majority of the allegations to the authorities in the first place so that guilt could be proven or not shows how little they really cared.

Wrong. That they disciplined the priests as soon as possible, shows that they do not tolerate this, and they don't need the state to intervene to tell them what to do. I'd agree if the Church said it was no big deal. They've never said this to be the case, and they have taken even the spurious accusations seriously.

How stupid are you... it's obvious to everybody but you who the appropriate authorities are. And they covered it up, plain and simple. It's a fact. Deal with it.

Frankly, when the 'appropriate' authorities see 3 years in jail and then out scot free as appropriate punishment for a child molestor, I have to ask, where is Justice? Do you believe that 3 years is sufficient Ming? I sure don't.

[Ben Kenobi]

Not entirely true. Though the Catholic Church is in good company when it comes to shuffling such people around Public Schools and the Boy Scouts apparently did as well.

According to whom? Wikipedia? Get a real source.

[Ben Kenobi]

1) Do you honestly believe the **** you are saying? What you are saying is so out of touch with reality that you would truly be best served by checking yourself into a mental institution and have them check you out.

Yes, I honestly believe what I'm saying here.

As for the rest of your crap, I'm not going to deign you with a response.

[DinoDoc]

According to whom? Wikipedia? Get a real source.

http://ncronline.org/news/accountabi...busive-priests

Fitzgerald's convictions appear to significantly contradict the claims of contemporary bishops that the hierarchy was unaware until recent years of the danger in shuffling priests from one parish to another and in concealing the priests' problems from those they served.

It is clear, too, in letters between Fitzgerald and a range of bishops, among bishops themselves, and between Fitzgerald and the Vatican, that the hierarchy was aware of the problem and its implications well before the problem surfaced as a national story in the mid-1980s.

Cardinal Roger Mahony of the Los Angeles archdiocese, reacting in February to a federal investigation into his handling of the crisis, said: "We have said repeatedly that ... our understanding of this problem and the way it's dealt with today evolved, and that in those years ago, decades ago, people didn't realize how serious this was, and so, rather than pulling people out of ministry directly and fully, they were moved."

[Ben Kenobi]

Cardinal Roger Mahony of the Los Angeles archdiocese

You don't want my opinion on Cardinal Roger Mahoney. Trust me.

Thanks for the article, DD.

[Ming]

Name me an instance where the Church would have jurisdiction, in your eyes.

If a priest allowed a non priest to say a mass.

Neither does the State have the authority to arrest a priest based on hearsay. As for the other diocese, why would they have any contact with the priest at all? Remember no contact with kids.

Hearsay? HUH? I'm talking about real charges... and then the court system can do it's job and determine if there is guilt.

This is proving innocence. Not the problem. You have to establish guilt not the other way around. The default is that all the priests are innocent and the accusations are lies. You have to be able to prove that the priest was in fact responsible.

But when the church never allows the opportunity to prove guilt or not...

I don't consider Christopher Hitchens who, by his own admission, hates the church, to be a reliable source on the workings of the church. I do, for example. Consider the Monsignor of the affected diocese a reliable source becuase he was there, particularly when he admits that he screwed up wrt to his oversight. Rose coloured glasses? Haven't I said that people suck? I'm the least rose-coloured glassed person here. Everyone here seems to hang on every word of Christopher Hitchens as if it were Gospel, and I'm the only one questioning his account.

Your opinion... and just that... an opinion.

Umm, they do this first, Ming, before it even goes out to the authorities. Remember your allegations of a cover up because they move the priests first? You might want to get your story straight here.

OK... I'll play your game... prove they do it first. You might want to check your ever changing stories and lies.

Wrong. That they disciplined the priests as soon as possible, shows that they do not tolerate this, and they don't need the state to intervene to tell them what to do. I'd agree if the Church said it was no big deal. They've never said this to be the case, and they have taken even the spurious accusations seriously.

Again... prove it. And it wasn't until they started getting called on it was any real action taken. And again, they aren't the proper authority here... the state is.

Frankly, when the 'appropriate' authorities see 3 years in jail and then out scot free as appropriate punishment for a child molestor, I have to ask, where is Justice? Do you believe that 3 years is sufficient Ming? I sure don't.

So... you think be moved to a new local and maybe losing a losing the right to do a few things is sufficient punishment? I SURE DON'T, and I'm pretty sure the victims would more likely agree with me on this.

[Ben Kenobi]

If a priest allowed a non priest to say a mass.

Ok. Now I have a better idea of where you are standing.

Hearsay? HUH? I'm talking about real charges... and then the court system can do it's job and determine if there is guilt.

Fair enough. I have no problem with the court system doing its job, but I don't think the priest should be subject to incarceration, unless he himself chooses to undertake it.

But when the church never allows the opportunity to prove guilt or not...

The church as a whole has been quite cooperative. Individual cardinals especially in the USCCB, no. But these folks are on the way out.

OK... I'll play your game... prove they do it first. You might want to check your ever changing stories and lies.

It's a fundamental principle, accused must be innocent before proven guilty. Asking me to 'prove innocence', means you lose.

Again... prove it. And it wasn't until they started getting called on it was any real action taken. And again, they aren't the proper authority here... the state is.

You have to prove that the coverup existed Ming. Who, what, where, when, why and how.

So... you think be moved to a new local and maybe losing a losing the right to do a few things is sufficient punishment? I SURE DON'T, and I'm pretty sure the victims would more likely agree with me on this.

You don't think being a pariah for 30 years isn't harsher punishment?

[Asher]

Yes, I honestly believe what I'm saying here.

As for the rest of your crap, I'm not going to deign you with a response.

Because you know it's true?

You are genuinely, truly mentally disturbed and in need of some help.

I only wish the owners of this site cared about you enough to ban you to give you a little encouragement.

[Asher]

According to whom? Wikipedia? Get a real source.

The wikipedia article is well-cited. See if you can ****ing figure out what the citations are on the site. Hint: click the little number thingies.

As soon as that was posted I knew you'd do this ****. People link you to an article which contains many reliable citations and links to them, you refuse to click it because of your "ignorance is bliss" attitude on life. This is why you are the most ignorant **** this site has ever seen.

[Ben Kenobi]

I only wish the owners of this site cared about you enough to ban you to give you a little encouragement.

You should make that your sig so you don't have to keep typing that out.

[Asher]

You should make that your sig so you don't have to keep typing that out.

You just want me to remove the current lines in my sig that let every newbie to this site know just how ****ed up you are.

I'm just trying to help you. Do the Christian thing. Save your soul.

You are going straight to hell with your behaviour, surely you see that? Even your fellow Christians here will surely tell you this. You are a cheat, a liar, and you have no respect for your fellow man. You are a terrible Christian.

[Ben Kenobi]

The wikipedia article is well-cited. See if you can ****ing figure out what the citations are on the site. Hint: click the little number thingies.

And DD immediately understood what I meant and posted the actual source.

Here's a clue. If you can find the citation, you can post the citation. It ain't hard. If DD can do it so can you.

As soon as that was posted I knew you'd do this ****. People link you to an article which contains many reliable citations and links to them, you refuse to click it because of your "ignorance is bliss" attitude on life. This is why you are the most ignorant **** this site has ever seen.

Meanwhile DD and I are exchanging links and digging into this issue.

Asher, is it fun living on a planet where you are always right?

[DaShi]

Meanwhile DD and I are exchanging links and digging into this issue.

The retarded leading the retarded.