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  • Socialism No Longer Has Negative Connotation

    “We’ve so overused the word ‘socialism’ that it no longer has the negative connotation it had 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago,” Mr. Anuzis said.



    But Can Obama Make the Trains Run on Time?
    By JOHN HARWOOD

    As they seek to jolt the economy out of recession, President Obama’s Treasury Department and the Federal Reserve have set aside worries about future inflation.

    But one form of inflation — rhetorical — may become a short-term hazard for Republicans seeking an effective strategy to oppose Mr. Obama’s activist-government agenda. As the Democratic Congress returns this week to juggle administration initiatives on energy, health care and financial regulation, the minority party faces an internal debate over striking the right tone.

    “Rhetorically, Republicans are having a very hard time finding something that raises the consciousness of the average voter,” said Saul Anuzis, a former chairman of the Michigan Republican Party who recently lost a bid to became national party chairman.

    Workaday labels like “big spender” and “liberal” have lost their punch, and last fall, Senator John McCain of Arizona and Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska gained little traction during the presidential campaign by linking Mr. Obama’s agenda to socialism.

    So Mr. Anuzis has turned to provocation with a purpose. He calls the president’s domestic agenda “economic fascism.”

    “We’ve so overused the word ‘socialism’ that it no longer has the negative connotation it had 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago,” Mr. Anuzis said. “Fascism — everybody still thinks that’s a bad thing.”

    Whether fellow Republicans think that is factually appropriate or strategically wise is another question.

    It’s Been Tried Before

    In modern American politics, linking opponents to totalitarianism typically signals that the side making the link is losing. Yet sometimes it works.

    In his come-from-behind 1948 victory, President Harry S. Truman, a Democrat, likened a vote for the Republican challenger, Thomas E. Dewey, to a vote for fascism. Four years later, as a vice-presidential candidate trying to break the Democrats’ 20-year grip on the White House, Richard M. Nixon ripped the Democratic nominee for president, Adlai E. Stevenson, as a graduate of the “cowardly college of Communist containment.”

    Later, his onetime speechwriter Patrick J. Buchanan recalled, Nixon “consciously kept the rhetoric cool” — even after the Democratic presidential challenger in 1972, George McGovern, compared him to Hitler. Ronald Reagan, a master of the temperate communication that fit the dominance of broadcast television, preferred humor to vitriol.

    But recent years have produced a boom market for harsher rhetoric, for reasons that include the polarization of the two political parties and the rising influence of cable television and the Internet. In 2004, for instance, The American Prospect magazine depicted an elephant’s trunk curling around the neck of the Statue of Liberty with the headline: “Stranglehold: The right-wing push for a one-party state.”

    Addressing President George W. Bush on MSNBC last year, the host Keith Olbermann declared, “You’re a fascist.”

    The epithet, commonly associated with Hitler’s Germany and Mussolini’s Italy, gained new currency among conservatives with the publication of Jonah Goldberg’s 2008 book, “Liberal Fascism.” This spring, an article in The American Spectator titled “Il Duce, Redux?” called Mr. Obama’s goals, language and conception of government “straight out of Mussolini’s playbook.”

    Mr. Anuzis noted that the Fox News commentator Glenn Beck had picked up the theme, as did some participants at the antitax “tea party” rallies last week. Mr. Anuzis spreads the word on Facebook and Twitter.

    But that discomfits other conservatives who question its accuracy and political wisdom.

    “I don’t think the word ‘fascism’ applies at all,” said the CNBC commentator Larry Kudlow, a sharp critic of Mr. Obama’s tax and spending policies. “Barack Obama is not a dictator. He’s a liberal.”

    Tony Fabrizio, a Republican pollster, said: “If what you’re trying to do is reach out to the middle, the more extreme the language, the less likely they are to pay attention. We sound like white noise in the background. It’s like a yipping Chihuahua.”

    Smile When You Say It

    The sharper language partly reflects pent-up frustrations over Mr. Bush, who presided over spending increases and the government’s $700 billion financial system bailout last fall. Now Republicans lament much more of the same from Mr. Obama.

    “They’re trying to figure out how to oppose a relatively popular president during an economic emergency,” said Robert Kuttner, co-editor of The American Prospect, dismissing the fascism charge. “That’s not an easy thing to do.”

    The practical question for Republicans is how best to reach political independents, 60 percent of whom now approve of Mr. Obama’s job performance. As his policies sink in, said William Kristol, editor of The Weekly Standard magazine, “I think ‘big-government-liberalism’ is good enough.”

    Mr. Anuzis remains unconvinced. He notes that he does not call Mr. Obama himself a “fascist.” Rather, he applies the “economic fascism” label to government tax and regulatory policies that seek, in the words of one magazine’s definition he cites, “to achieve the utopian socialist ideal.”

    “It’s politically very incorrect only because we’re not used to it,” concluded Mr. Anuzis, who recently joined American Solutions for Winning the Future, a group led by Newt Gingrich, a former House speaker. But he acknowledged, “You’ve got to be careful using the term ‘economic fascism’ in the right way, so it doesn’t come off as extreme.”
    Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

  • #2
    You'd think that they'd realize that Fascism and Socialism are kinda on opposite sides of the spectrum.

    Then you realize that the demagogues usually don't care about that, and usually when people are slurring others, they only look at the harsh invective value, not the actual meaning of what's being said.
    B♭3

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Q Classic View Post
      You'd think that they'd realize that Fascism and Socialism are kinda on opposite sides of the spectrum.
      I hate to defend the talk-show name callers, but from the perspective of an free-market individualist, Fascism and Socialism are both wrong for the same reasons.

      I'd describe the current situation as veering more towards Fascist corporatism than socialism. Still, the two can coincide, like if the government were steering resources towards favored corporations and extorting those corporations into providing social goods as repayment (e.g. car companies given bailouts to maintain their private welfare programs).

      Really, considering that Socialism advocates a public control over the means of production, and Fascism concerns itself with government involvement in corporations, they aren't really mutually exclusive. I think the perception that they are opposites is a product of post-Barbarossa Soviet propaganda.
      John Brown did nothing wrong.

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      • #4
        I am pretty sure it would have something to do with there not being a dictatoral super power practisioner of it threatening nuclear oblivion acting as its poster boy for the last twenty years. That tends to soften your image a bit.
        "The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Felch View Post
          I hate to defend the talk-show name callers, but from the perspective of an free-market individualist, Fascism and Socialism are both wrong for the same reasons.

          I'd describe the current situation as veering more towards Fascist corporatism than socialism. Still, the two can coincide, like if the government were steering resources towards favored corporations and extorting those corporations into providing social goods as repayment (e.g. car companies given bailouts to maintain their private welfare programs).

          Really, considering that Socialism advocates a public control over the means of production, and Fascism concerns itself with government involvement in corporations, they aren't really mutually exclusive. I think the perception that they are opposites is a product of post-Barbarossa Soviet propaganda.
          I suppose that's valid. They're both so extreme on one side that they sort of loop around.

          That said, the philosophical fundamentals, why in both cases government exerts control in the corporate sector are vastly different.

          For instance, you could make the argument that the government's crony capitalism in SKorea, Taiwan, and Japan were borderline Fascist, but not so much so that they were Socialist--all three nations were fundamentally anti-Communist and anti-Socialist, viewing any hint in that direction a betrayal of their "democracies". The egalitarianist ideals found in Socialism weren't the driving forces; rather, all of them sought to rebuild their economies for the greater good of their nation-state, with the individuals subsuming their rights to the company and to the body politic.
          B♭3

          Comment


          • #6
            the word ‘socialism’ that it no longer has the negative connotation it had 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago


            The title lies.

            You are as bad as Oerdin

            Ok, maybe not that bad.
            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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            • #7
              LOL - compare Obama to Mussolini - the former really has charisma, while the later´s big mouth was only good enough to impress italians (and make everybody else, except Hitler, laugh). Name-calling is, btw, a very mature way of doing politics - so much on the topic and always beneficial to the people...

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              • #8
                Let's not underestimate Mussolini's charisma. He was incompetent in everything else, but could give a speech (though Hitler was far better in that).
                “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hitler just had better advance men.
                  I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Patroklos View Post
                    I am pretty sure it would have something to do with there not being a dictatoral super power practisioner of it threatening nuclear oblivion acting as its poster boy for the last twenty years. That tends to soften your image a bit.
                    So that's why so many people are considering Nazism?
                    Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui View Post
                      the word ‘socialism’ that it no longer has the negative connotation it had 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago


                      The title lies.

                      You are as bad as Oerdin

                      Ok, maybe not that bad.
                      The title does not lie. I just edited for brevity. The point here is, the GOP has rehabilitated us. Thanks to them, socialism is no longer a dirty word.
                      Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Patroklos View Post
                        I am pretty sure it would have something to do with there not being a dictatoral super power practisioner of it threatening nuclear oblivion acting as its poster boy for the last twenty years. That tends to soften your image a bit.
                        One would think that Europe would be a good enough arguement against it with its anemic economic growth and basket case politics.

                        Socialism doesn't exactly equal communism after all.
                        I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                        For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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                        • #13
                          Perhaps the Republicans should start calling Obama a conservative.
                          “As a lifelong member of the Columbia Business School community, I adhere to the principles of truth, integrity, and respect. I will not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do.”
                          "Capitalism ho!"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Really, considering that Socialism advocates a public control over the means of production, and Fascism concerns itself with government involvement in corporations, they aren't really mutually exclusive. I think the perception that they are opposites is a product of post-Barbarossa Soviet propaganda.
                            Stalinism and National socialism are very similar, because they look to nationalities. Trotskyites are different because they align according to class.

                            The only real difference is that both subsume the individual to the collective. In the former, it is the nation, in the latter, is it his class.

                            The real spectrum is not so much communism/liberal/conservative/fascist, really it is:

                            communism/fascism/liberal/conservative/libertarian/anarchist.


                            collective --> Individual.
                            Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                            "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                            2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

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                            • #15
                              I just edited for brevity.


                              While changing the entire meaning
                              “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                              - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                              Comment

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