Marriage, Gays, and Atheists

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Wow, the swarm is out in force.

3 people have posted and none of them have actually rebutted a point that I actually made.

I see how you 'win' an argument.

Methinks you don't understand the argument you make. You've yet to make one. I've seen lots of funny comments though that I've responded to. Which you've ignored.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi

Oh I'll get married as soon as I can. Why should I fight for a nation that has no respect for my ideals? If Canada and the US want to destroy themselves, they can go right ahead and do so. I don't have to lift a finger to hold back the tide.

How will granting gays and lesbians the civil right to marry destroy marriage for straight people?? Or a nation for that matter!?

[Kidlicious]

BK is glorifying the state just like Drake does. Interesting.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Boris,

So men are absolutely interchangeable with women?

When it comes to the government recognition of their rights, absolutely. Our Constitution made only one distinction between males and females, which was voting rights, and that was stripped away a long, long time ago.

Wow, you completely missed the point of my post. All I am saying is that men and women are fundamentally different from each other.

No, I got your point. But your "trying to square a circle" comment is a direct jab at same-sex relations, as you said it "doesn't work." I can assure you, it does.

The state has an interest in self-preservation. Promoting suicidal ideologies doesn't really help in those goals. I don't see why the state would want to encourage them at the expense of their own survival. Yes, liberties are important, but it's pretty pointless to argue about your natural rights to a society that rejects the concept of natural rights altogether.

There's no evidence allowing gay marriage is "suicidal." This is you once again asserting something without a shred of evidence. So the entire basis for your argument is complete bunk.

Heterosexual marriage rates haven't changed in societies that have allowed gay marriage. No studies have offered any evidence that allowing gay marriage impacts hetero marriage whatsoever.

Your entire argument hinges on the stupid idea that allowing gay marriages will somehow end heterosexual marriages, which is simply not the case.

Oh I'll get married as soon as I can. Why should I fight for a nation that has no respect for my ideals? If Canada and the US want to destroy themselves, they can go right ahead and do so. I don't have to lift a finger to hold back the tide.

First you'd have to find some poor girl to put up with you.

So you prove my case--allowing gay marriage won't stop "heterosexuals" like you from wanting to get married.

Check your PMs, btw.

EDIT: Ah you got it already, good.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov


Check your PMs, btw.

Please tell me you're not sending BK steamy love letters.

[Ben Kenobi]

No, he just sent me Asher's nude pics.

I can do without that Boris, but thanks.

[MrFun]

Back on the track. So answer Boris and I - how would granting gays and lesbians civil right to marry destroy marriage among heterosexuals?

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
No, he just sent me Asher's nude pics.

I can do without that Boris, but thanks.

I'm sorry, I forgot you already had thousands of pictures of naked men. My bad.

[Kidlicious]

Wait. Boris keeps nude pics of Asher on his computer?

[Asher]

He's not the only one.

I've only made one porno, but it became an instant classic in the gay scene. A celebrity in your midst all this time, and you had no idea...

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Wait. Boris keeps nude pics of Asher on his computer?

They came free as sample images. All the gays' computers come with them.

[Ben Kenobi]

When it comes to the government recognition of their rights, absolutely. Our Constitution made only one distinction between males and females, which was voting rights, and that was stripped away a long, long time ago.

That doesn't answer my question, Boris. Are men and women interchangeable? It's a simple yes or no. Just because men are different from women doesn't mean that they have fewer rights then women.

No, I got your point. But your "trying to square a circle" comment is a direct jab at same-sex relations, as you said it "doesn't work." I can assure you, it does.

I'm glad you managed to absorb the thrust of my argument unlike your companions.

There's no evidence allowing gay marriage is "suicidal."

It's a rather simple argument. Societies are sustained by encouraging men and women to get married and have children, and raise them until they can repeat the cycle. Gay marriage does nothing to help things. Given the fact that the west is already having trouble, it is suicidal. Where are the kids going to come from Boris? Surely you can't see and agree with me that the west is dying, slowly but surely.

Heterosexual marriage rates haven't changed in societies that have allowed gay marriage. No studies have offered any evidence that allowing gay marriage impacts hetero marriage whatsoever.

Wait 20 years. Just because the rates haven't changed yet isn't an argument that they will not have an effect in the future. I would argue that in societies which have endorsed gay marriage, that it will be the most significant effect. Up here in Canada, there really is no point to gay marriage, because the only ones who get married now are tourists from abroad. I hardly think that was the purpose of the legislation to export gay marriage around the world.

Your entire argument hinges on the stupid idea that allowing gay marriages will somehow end heterosexual marriages, which is simply not the case.

I never said that. All I said is that it weakens society and makes it more likely that you won't have these privileges in the future.

First you'd have to find some poor girl to put up with you.

True, but I would love to get married soon. Tired of being on my own. Want to have a family of my own.

[Traianvs]

: popcorn :

[Traianvs]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov


Heterosexual marriage rates haven't changed in societies that have allowed gay marriage. No studies have offered any evidence that allowing gay marriage impacts hetero marriage whatsoever.

Your entire argument hinges on the stupid idea that allowing gay marriages will somehow end heterosexual marriages, which is simply not the case.

I'm not gay or anything, not prejudiced by any way whatsoever, but I'd like to concur on that. 'Traditional' people claim 'values' will be lost when gay people will be lost. But seriously, those 'values' are all very recent if you care to take a detailed look, and are constantly changing anyway. Gays can marry in our country, and really. Really. Reaaaally: straight couples don't wed any less. They still marry for the very same reasons the people 100 years ago did.

It's all about giving other people more rights. In fact: gays win, but straight people don't lose. To be more specific without the media attention nobody really gives a flying **** about gay or lesbian couples engaging in marriage around here.

Although the respective families might still find it awkward mind you... it's still a bit of a taboo in a way.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
That doesn't answer my question, Boris. Are men and women interchangeable? It's a simple yes or no. Just because men are different from women doesn't mean that they have fewer rights then women.

It answers your question better than it deserved.

If we're talking about legal rights, then gender differences is a moot point. Nothing about rights is gender-specific. Pointing out that men have weiners and women hav vajayjays is 100% irrelevant to legal rights of people.

It's a rather simple argument. Societies are sustained by encouraging men and women to get married and have children, and raise them until they can repeat the cycle. Gay marriage does nothing to help things.

It's "simple" if by "simple" you mean "stupid," yes. Society IS still encouraging men and women to get married and have children. Adding gays to the mix doesn't change it.

Given the fact that the west is already having trouble, it is suicidal. Where are the kids going to come from Boris? Surely you can't see and agree with me that the west is dying, slowly but surely.

Where are the kids going to come from? OH THAT'S RIGHT, I forgot that allowing gay marriage necessitates the legal prohibition of hetero marriages and that all straight people will be forced into childless gay sex slave relationships. Silly me.

Really, are actually making this argument? Really?

Wait 20 years. Just because the rates haven't changed yet isn't an argument that they will not have an effect in the future. I would argue that in societies which have endorsed gay marriage, that it will be the most significant effect. Up here in Canada, there really is no point to gay marriage, because the only ones who get married now are tourists from abroad. I hardly think that was the purpose of the legislation to export gay marriage around the world.

"There's no evidence for my point of view whatsoever, but wait 20 years and we'll talk!"

Sweet Jebus, this is so ****ing retarded...

And if Canadian gays aren't taking advantage of their legal right to wed, then so what? The point is it's there if they want it. Completely irrelevant to the argument.

I never said that. All I said is that it weakens society and makes it more likely that you won't have these privileges in the future.

Which is unsubstantiated by any evidence currently available. But we'll wait 20 years, and then we'll see!

True, but I would love to get married soon. Tired of being on my own. Want to have a family of my own.

It would be nice if you'd extend the same courtesy to a gay person who wanted to do this as well, but apparently you're only concerned with your own happiness and nobody else's.