Some People think all Veterans Are Evil

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Ok, you either are incapable of understanding a pacifist pov, or you will continue to pretend that you can not. I've presented my argument.

I thought you are in favour of violent revolution. I think Che is as well.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by notyoueither
I thought you are in favour of violent revolution. I think Che is as well.

I used to be. I'm for civil disobedience.

Pacifists aren't necessarily against all violence though, just most.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Kidicious


I used to be. I'm for civil disobedience.

Pacifists aren't necessarily against all violence though, just most.

I see. So the violence you think is justified is OK then?

[Kidlicious]

A few anti-war quotes

“All war must be just the killing of strangers against whom you feel no personal animosity; strangers whom, in other circumstances, you would help if you found them in trouble, and who would help you if you needed it”

- Mark Twain

“I am not only a pacifist but a militant pacifist. I am willing to fight for peace. Nothing will end war unless the people themselves refuse to go to war.”

- Albert Einstein

“Another thing against war is that it seldom if ever kills off the right people”

- Anonymous (I think)

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by notyoueither


I see. So the violence you think is justified is OK then?

"Ok" only means that I would prefer to do it as opposed to not doing it. I'm not necessarily against violence, just mindless violence. I am against violence generally though, and I think that it is usually not the best thing to do.

[Grandpa Troll]

Originally posted by Kidicious


There's a lot of ways to fight for you rights. One way is to use non-violence and civil disobedience. People like Che and myself have done as much to fight for rights as veterens. Many pacifists have made very significant sacrifices.

Well, after the last debate with you, I have decided to not argue with a brick

Now, I must have misread title of thread, I am not debating weather there are way to support other than violence, a thought process or a way to get to the end of a debate other than violence, I was merely supporting veterans, of which i am proud to call myself a Veteran.

I did not say if someone is not a veteran, they have no idea what it is like to place themselves in harms way, i know, I read about countless recording daily of examples of non-violent support of a cause that results in someone dieing.

But as a Veteran, you can be punished by imprisonment or even death penalty for failing to disobey a Lawful order, during times of war is so deemed by a convened Court Martial hearing.

Look in the UCMJ, Chapter 10

885. ART. 85. DESERTION
(a) Any member of the armed forces who--
(1) without authority goes or remains absent from his unit, organization, or place of duty with intent to remain away therefrom permanently;
(2) quits his unit, organization, or place of duty with intent to avoid hazardous duty or to shirk important service; or
(3) without being regularly separated from one of the armed forces enlists or accepts an appointment in the same or another on of the armed forces without fully disclosing the fact that he has not been regularly separated, or enters any foreign armed service except when authorized by the United States; is guilty of desertion.
(b) Any commissioned officer of the armed forces who, after tender of his resignation and before notice of its acceptance, quits his post or proper duties without leave and with intent to remain away therefrom permanently is guilty of desertion.
(c) Any person found guilty of desertion or attempt to desert shall be punished, if the offense is committed in time of war, by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct, but if the desertion or attempt to desert occurs at any other time, by such punishment, other than death, as a court-martial may direct.

Now as a Veteran, I support, during the course of war, death penalty for abandoning a post unless given a lawful order.

I will say I would not expect a non military veteran to understand or agree, but for those who chose to serve their country faithfully, then they know that serveing means laying the life of your own or of those in your charge down for a mission, weather its FUBAR in nature or not, it is the Law and as such must be adheared to.

Period

Gramps

[Grandpa Troll]

Originally posted by Kidicious


I used to be. I'm for civil disobedience.

Pacifists aren't necessarily against all violence though, just most.

Almost signature material old buddy

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Kidicious


"Ok" only means that I would prefer to do it as opposed to not doing it. I'm not necessarily against violence, just mindless violence. I am against violence generally though, and I think that it is usually not the best thing to do.

I'm not sure I follow.

You seem to be saying you are not really a pacifist. While you would prefer to avoid violence, it isn't something you will rule out.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Grandpa Troll
Now as a Veteran, I support, during the course of war, death penalty for abandoning a post unless given a lawful order.

Wow. I wonder if you actually thought about that. This is the perfect reason why killing Germans in the name of the USA was stupid.

Also, who exactly were you not arguing with?

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by notyoueither


I'm not sure I follow.

You seem to be saying you are not really a pacifist. While you would prefer to avoid violence, it isn't something you will rule out.

You will have to stop your black and white thinking if you are to understand my argument. That's the only way we can continue. Like I said pacifists are generally against violence, particularly mindless violence. Some go so far as to be completely against it, usually religionists.

[notyoueither]

Mindless as defined by whom?

[Grandpa Troll]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Wow. I wonder if you actually thought about that. This is the perfect reason why killing Germans in the name of the USA was stupid.

Also, who exactly were you not arguing with?

who said I was not arguing with someone?

Did I think this out, I am asking you if your speaking of me, Grandpa Troll, the Veteran who quoted scripture from the UCMJ?

Spoiler:

Im sorry if it seems a bit sarcastic, but who the hell else do you think wrote this and yes, I am in full agreement as posted above, with this decision, oh and as for killing Germans, which German citizen was killed by a U S Soldier while not engaged during an act of military suppression? A few innocents yes, unfortunate, but did you have a specific incident and by the way, are you a nazi sympathizer or was there something you misunderstood about why we entered and partook of military actions in WWII?

[Verto]

I'm amazed at how much time you have all wasted arguing with people who think communism is a good idea.

[Kidlicious]

"Im sorry if it seems a bit sarcastic, but who the hell else do you think wrote this and yes, I am in full agreement as posted above, with this decision, oh and as for killing Germans, which German citizen was killed by a U S Soldier while not engaged during an act of military suppression? A few innocents yes, unfortunate, but did you have a specific incident and by the way, are you a nazi sympathizer or was there something you misunderstood about why we enetred into WWII?"

Why would I kill a German (or any person of foreign orgin for that matter) who doesn't want to kill me for not killing someone else, when I can kill an American who does want to kill me for not killing someone.

[Grandpa Troll]

Originally posted by Verto
I'm amazed at how much time you have all wasted arguing with people who think communism is a good idea.

Yeah, I just checked this out as I was away during Veterans Day, thought I would put my two cents in,

I know, I know, but arguing with Kidicious Bricks sometimes can be Hard to pass by, amusing as such