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The Amethyst Initiative

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  • #1

    The Amethyst Initiative

    You've probably heard of it: a proposal by a hundred or so college presidents to start a discussion on lowering the U.S. drinking age to eighteen. Here's the announcement from my college's president, which I believe is a pretty typical representative:

    http://news.washcoll.edu/press_releases/2008/08/19_amesthystinitiative.php


    MADD and various other organizations are up in arms about it. I personally am on the college's side about this; getting booze as an eighteen-year-old on campus is already comically easy, and forcing them to keep it underground just increases the danger.

    So: What's your opinion? [/kentbrockmanvoice]
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    Only banana juice for those brats!
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  • #2
    Let them drink. Keep them out of the bars, there are crowded with enough immature kids as it is.
    "The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.

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    • #3
      What Pat said.

      They're gonna drink. If you make it such that they must go off-campus to drink, they will and they will then kill themselves driving drunk back to campus. It's stupid, but it's reality.

      edit: of course, that's only dealing with colleges (no real need to change the law back to 18, but rather simply don't really enforce it on campus). In general...

      I still think that if you're old enough to be in the army, you're old enough to have a beer. Focus on drunk driving and the like - that's the problem. So yeah, I support 18 as the legal drinking age.

      -Arrian
      grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

      The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

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      • #4
        When I went through school, everybody had a fake ID to drink. The result is that not only was the drinking law not respected, but also a more serious crime like forgery of government documents became commonplace.

        Because of this, I support a reexamination.
        I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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        • #5
          Don't all civlized places already have the drinking limit at 18? I mean you can enlist in the army or vote at that age, why shouldn't you be allowed to kill a few brain cells?



          edit: Oh its about the US
          Last edited by Heraclitus; August 22, 2008, 18:17.
          Modern man calls walking more quickly in the same direction down the same road “change.”
          The world, in the last three hundred years, has not changed except in that sense.
          The simple suggestion of a true change scandalizes and terrifies modern man. -Nicolás Gómez Dávila

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          • #6
            The good points at restricting the drinking age:

            Teen years and pre age 4 are the two times when the human brain is the most susceptible to altering substances. It makes sense to be very careful about your intake at these times.

            Teen's aren't very wise at times. They are smart, but not wise. A lot of the stupid stuff done with alcohol is done by teens.

            Increasing the drinking age lowered the amount of accidents in america by a lot. A lot of <21 age people drive drunk apparently, or are worse at driving drunk than >21 people.

            A lot of bad stuff is done by alcohol use, most people who don't start drinking until they are >21 never abuse alcohol.

            Bad points about restricting the drinking age:

            They do it anyway. Having defacto law breaking is never a good thing. Then people decide it is OK to break the law (same issue with speeding).

            They are adults, they should be able to choose things for themselves.

            I remember thinking that there were three points here, but can't remember the third right now.

            Jon Miller
            Jon Miller-
            I AM.CANADIAN
            GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

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            • #7
              Heh. Our "fake IDs" were our college IDs with scotch tape over the DOB. You took a pencil and turned the "6" in "1976" to a zero. Voila! Fake ID.

              It fooled no one, obviously. But the bar just off campus considered that to be enough. Once I didn't bother with it. I got a roll of the eyes and a "oh come on, make the effort! Get in there" from the guy at the door.

              Of course, that bar got shut down...

              -Arrian
              grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

              The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

              Comment

              • #8
                The fact that people break the law is NOT a reason to change the law. If there are reasons to change the law other than that, do (like with speeding, where speed limits are often too low); but not simply because they break the law.

                I'm against it, because SOME people don't break the law and drink young, and I think those people are helped by the extra three years. I also think it would become a similar problem, just a few years younger; people are more likely to drink at 19 or 20 than at 16 or 17 at the moment, in some part due to the age being 21; this would be less the case if it were lowered. Finally, I'm all for protecting the people who actually follow the law, and don't give a **** about those who don't care to.

                If we wanted to enforce this law, we could and would; certain college towns have become quite successful at doing so.
                <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
                I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

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                • #9
                  The fact that people break the law is NOT a reason to change the law
                  Not in and of itself, no.

                  It could be the law is being broken because it's a stupid law, but then like you say change the law b/c of said stupidity.

                  In this instance, the strongest argument is that for most things, our society treats 18 year olds as adults. You can fight in a war, own a gun, be tried for a crime as an adult, etc. But not drink? Meh.

                  -Arrian
                  grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                  The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    There are good reasons you can't... as I referred to in my post.

                    I personally think it should stay at 21, although I have given alcohol to minors a time or two.

                    JM
                    Jon Miller-
                    I AM.CANADIAN
                    GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Arrian


                      Not in and of itself, no.

                      It could be the law is being broken because it's a stupid law, but then like you say change the law b/c of said stupidity.

                      In this instance, the strongest argument is that for most things, our society treats 18 year olds as adults. You can fight in a war, own a gun, be tried for a crime as an adult, etc. But not drink? Meh.

                      -Arrian
                      "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

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                      • #12
                        It's 18 in Alberta and 19 in the rest of Canada and we're just fine.

                        It's 18 in the UK too and their consumption is higher yet their drunk driving rate is far below that of the USA also.
                        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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                        • #13
                          Would it help my argument any if I said I think the drinking age should be 55?



                          In any event, the fact that we have a higher DD rate than the UK even with 21 is an argument for why it should be 21 here - obviously we can't handle our booze properly. I don't believe the 21 drinking age has anything to do with the reason for our DD rate being so high...
                          <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
                          I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by snoopy369
                            The fact that people break the law is NOT a reason to change the law.
                            I don't agree. Setting laws that everybody breaks erodes respect for the law overall.
                            I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Asher
                              It's 18 in Alberta and 19 in the rest of Canada and we're just fine.
                              18 in quebec too, which makes gatineau a popular location for 18th birthday celebrations

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