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  • Please buy our dirty oil

    That sounds like a good thread title to begin a discussion about Canadian oil.

    Canada
    Please buy our dirty oil

    Mar 13th 2008 | OTTAWA
    From The Economist print edition
    A new American law could limit oil-sands production in Alberta

    CANADIANS like to think that although they are the junior partner in their trade relations with the United States, the 174 billion barrels of proven reserves in the oil sands of Alberta provide a powerful ace up their sleeve in any dealings with their energy-hungry neighbour. That belief has now been shaken by an American law that appears to prohibit American government agencies from buying crude produced in the oil sands of the western province.

    The Energy Independence and Security Act 2007 did not set out to discriminate against Canada, America's biggest supplier of oil. But that is the effect of banning federal agencies from buying alternative or synthetic fuel, including that from non-conventional sources, if their production and use result in more greenhouse gases than conventional oil. Transforming Alberta's tarry muck into a barrel of oil is an energy-intensive process that produces about three times the emissions of a barrel of conventional light sweet crude.

    Having woken belatedly to the danger, the Canadian government is now scrambling to secure an exception. Michael Wilson, Canada's ambassador in Washington, has written to America's secretary of defence, Robert Gates (whose department is a big purchaser of Canadian oil), stressing American dependence on Canadian oil, electricity, natural gas and uranium imports, and noting that some of the biggest players in the Alberta oil patch are American companies. Mr Wilson added plaintively that both George Bush and his energy secretary, Samuel Bodman, have publicly welcomed expanded oil-sands production, given the increased contribution to American energy security.

    John Baird, the Canadian environment minister, referred this week to the American move when he unveiled new proposals to reduce industrial emissions in Canada, including the oil sands, by 20% by 2020. Big states like California were making similar pronouncements, he told reporters. The oil sands were an important national resource, but had to be expanded in an environmentally friendly way.

    The fear in Canada is that the American purchasing restrictions, which at present apply only to federal agencies, is the start of a wholesale shift to greener as well as more protectionist policies under a Congress and potentially a White House controlled by the Democrats. With energy exports, mainly from Alberta, driving the Canadian economy, this is not a happy thought for Canadians.

    Yet environmentalists point out that Canada is now paying for its own foot-dragging at the federal level on green initiatives. Having signed the Kyoto agreement under a previous Liberal government, Canada did little to stop its emissions rising. They are now almost 35% above the Kyoto target. And although Mr Baird likes to describe his plan as tough, it will not bring Canada into line with Kyoto. The rules for the oil sands, now the fastest growing source of greenhouse gases, have yet to be finalised and will not come into force until 2010. Furthermore, they rely on carbon capture, a promising but unproven technology.

    The vagueness of the proposed federal rules did not stop the premier of Alberta, Ed Stelmach, from giving a defiant warning that he will stand up for the interests of Albertans (read oil industry) and will be examining the constitution to ensure that the federal government's proposed plan does not intrude on provincial jurisdiction. His province has one of the weakest environmental regimes in Canada.

    Although the Canadian embassy says that there has been no official response to Mr Wilson's letter, there are reports of talks going on in Washington aimed at addressing Canada's concerns. But even if a deal is reached with the outgoing Bush administration, any exception for Canada may be short-lived if green-tinged Democrats take the White House in November.
    Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

  • #2
    This should be your first thread title in months that won't srit up too many objections...

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    • #3
      Yeah, but I only get objections from Asher & DinoDoc so no biggy.
      Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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      • #5
        Well that explains those mysterious grease slicks used to sabotage Air France Airbus planes landing at Toronto airport.

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        • #6
          Won't happen. They'll make an exemption.
          Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
          "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
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          • #7
            Not to mention that by the time the oil actually leaves Alberta it's upgraded to the point of being indistinguishable from conventional oil.

            I'm sure the world's best geologist knows all about this.

            I'm not sure why the article talks about the "fear in Canada", no one in Canada is the least bit worried about this. The US is desperately and pathetically in need of Alberta's oil. If you think gas prices now are high, wait til Alberta cuts you guys off and starts shipping directly to China. Now is not the time to lose your #1 supplier.
            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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            • #8
              (Although I think the law is moronic
              The point of the law is not to forbid the use of oil that is dirty. It is to forbid the use of oil that increased the net greenhouse gasses in the world to be produced.
              <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
              I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

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              • #9
                Originally posted by snoopy369
                (Although I think the law is moronic
                The point of the law is not to forbid the use of oil that is dirty. It is to forbid the use of oil that increased the net greenhouse gasses in the world to be produced.
                Why don't you remind everyone what the purpose of oil is? And what one of the unavoidable results of consuming oil is?
                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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                • #10
                  I said I think the law is moronic
                  <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
                  I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

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                  • #11
                    The old thread title was much better.
                    Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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                    • #12
                      You're lucky I didn't manipulate my minions in the new administration to perma-ban you.
                      "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                      Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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                      • #13
                        The title of this thread is very misleading. It should be more like "Asher is oily and smells".

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                        • #14
                          Originally posted by Asher
                          Not to mention that by the time the oil actually leaves Alberta it's upgraded to the point of being indistinguishable from conventional oil.

                          I'm sure the world's best geologist knows all about this.
                          As others have said, that's not the point of the article. The point is that the process of separating the oil from the sand is generating three times the level of greenhouse gases than the less-intensive processes used in other parts of the world where the oil *isn't* fused with sand.

                          I'm not sure why the article talks about the "fear in Canada", no one in Canada is the least bit worried about this. The US is desperately and pathetically in need of Alberta's oil. If you think gas prices now are high, wait til Alberta cuts you guys off and starts shipping directly to China. Now is not the time to lose your #1 supplier.
                          Funny, I was left with the impression that the U.S. law wasn't passed with Canada in mind but, rather, the environment in general. Besides, even with the use of more wind, solar and "clean coal" power, the U.S. is still going to need a good dose of oil (after all, it doesn't just fuel vehicles) and, as an American, I'd rather have what we need from nations closer to us not only in terms of geography, but general values as well (the Bush administration not withstanding).

                          Heh. Generally speaking, I guess being concerned for the environment is good — unless, of course, it's about to impact your neighborhood in terms of potential lost jobs. Then NIMBY kicks in. I'm familiar with the feeling, since there is a coal-fired power plant in my region looking to expand and another that might be built ... both of which aren't exactly getting a green light at this moment in time. I guess it's a good thing a windblade plant is going up in town ... 750 jobs within a couple of years, from what I've been told.

                          Gatekeeper
                          "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll die defending your right to say it." — Voltaire

                          "Wheresoever you go, go with all your heart." — Confucius

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                          • #15
                            *yawn*

                            Federal agencies can't buy oil sands products. How do they tell the source of the gasoline at the wholesaler?

                            Still, I guess it's time to invite China to build some really big pipelines to Prince George.
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