Science Fiction as Literature

[Ming]

Originally posted by Impaler[WrG]
Sci-Fi at its most 'hard' emphasis a kind of thought experimentation on the future given a set of assumptions, usually technological developments or future events. Characters and their development are de-emphasized in favor of the setting which needs to be explained in detail.

Granted there is some SF out there that meets your description... However, I would argue that the best SF is when the settings and technological developments are used to set up the Characters, and emphazie them as they are forced to deal with situations that aren't possible in traditional fiction. And in the process, explores the nature of humanity. While I majored in Journalism, I have minors in both Literature and Rhetoric so I had to read all the "classics". I find many SF books to be as good, if not better, in exploring the nature of man.

[Nostromo]

"Literature" focuses on emotional and morale quandary seen through well developed characters. Setting is de-emphasized which allows for the "head-hunting" Imran describes (best genre works being reclassified as Lit). Some noticeable examples Moby Dick and The Catcher in the Rhye .

That's very reductive definition. I'm not sure it includes Kafka or Beckett. Trying to define literature by its content is probably a lost cause anyway.

[Nostromo]

I don't understand why you guys think that genre-fiction labels were invented by snotty literature professors and imposed on the writers. It seems to me that a lot/most sci-fi writers see themselves as sci-fi writers, and not writers of mainstream literature. They tend to hang out with other sci-fi writers. They have sci-fi conventions and book prizes. So they seem to embrace the label.

[Ben Kenobi]

Just curious, Ben: both "Canticle for Liebowitz" and "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep" are novels. What are they doing on your short-story list?

They both have been adapted as short stories, that's how I came across them and it wasn't until later I realised they were entire novels.

I thought they made very good short stories too, so I left them there.

[Tuberski]

Originally posted by Impaler[WrG]
The explanation for this opinion has also been widely discussed and I think people are a bit off the track when they argue that the blame falls on a single group. The potential culprits are 1) Elite Academia 2) snotty Liberal arts majors and other 'middle brows' 3) the rank and file High School English teachers. I believe all three agree with each other and reinforce each others options to create an Iron Triangle of prejudice. Each may have its own primary reasons such as Academia's disdain for for-profit writing, the middle brow revulsion for anything the common man likes, and the rank and file English teachers dislike for action oriented plot lines.

I actually had to read "Ice Station Zebra" for HS English.

ACK!

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Nostromo
I don't understand why you guys think that genre-fiction labels were invented by snotty literature professors and imposed on the writers. It seems to me that a lot/most sci-fi writers see themselves as sci-fi writers, and not writers of mainstream literature. They tend to hang out with other sci-fi writers. They have sci-fi conventions and book prizes. So they seem to embrace the label.

Quite. When Apolytoners start threads asking for recommendations in science fiction, it's safe bet they're not thinking about The Time Traveller's Wife. If someone does recommend such books, they'll probably include a disclaimer, saying 'it's not true sci-fi' or something.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Perfection
How is this misogynist? Women generally dislike scifi! Is that a horrible thing to say?

Without anything other than your sexist opinion to support it, yes.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Sandman
Quite. When Apolytoners start threads asking for recommendations in science fiction, it's safe bet they're not thinking about The Time Traveller's Wife. If someone does recommend such books, they'll probably include a disclaimer, saying 'it's not true sci-fi' or something.

Personally when I ask for sci-fi, I'm looking for "soft science fiction". Novels that examine characters and and their growth in speculative settings. I am not necessarily into "hard science fiction" because I'd rather have the focus on the characters than the science.

The aforementioned "The Road" is a great example. The setting of a nuclear fallout world is there to set up the characters and their interactions with each other as well as with the harsh realities of life as it is in this world.

[Ben Kenobi]

And you still like Canticle?

You have an odd taste Imran.

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by molly bloom


Without anything other than your sexist opinion to support it, yes.

Indeed... I know more women who like Science Fiction than men, for example. I was turned onto SF/F by a woman, and know quite a few women who enjoy SF novels of all types...

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by Nostromo
I don't understand why you guys think that genre-fiction labels were invented by snotty literature professors and imposed on the writers. It seems to me that a lot/most sci-fi writers see themselves as sci-fi writers, and not writers of mainstream literature. They tend to hang out with other sci-fi writers. They have sci-fi conventions and book prizes. So they seem to embrace the label.

I don't think anyone sane would argue that SF as a genre is solely a definition used by snotty literature professors. I think the argument is that snotty professors use the definition to lessen the value of some novels as opposed to others. They point to a novel such as DADoES and suggest it is something less because it is science fiction, and then point to The Road and say it is great literature, but not a word about SF...

FWIW, I think Time Traveller's Wife is science fiction. When someone asks me for a rec, I generally try to figure out what sort of SF they read - I read all types but most people have a sub-genre they prefer.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui




Personally when I ask for sci-fi, I'm looking for "soft science fiction". Novels that examine characters and and their growth in speculative settings. I am not necessarily into "hard science fiction" because I'd rather have the focus on the characters than the science.

The aforementioned "The Road" is a great example. The setting of a nuclear fallout world is there to set up the characters and their interactions with each other as well as with the harsh realities of life as it is in this world.

Hard science fiction is often poorly written and poor stories. I mostly prefer soft science fiction.

JM

[snoopy369]

Perhaps you need to read better-written hard science fiction then

Charles Sheffield is a good start.

[Ben Kenobi]

Hard science fiction is often poorly written and poor stories. I mostly prefer soft science fiction.

Yes, but you are a physicist so you don't count.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
And you still like Canticle?

You have an odd taste Imran.

I think Canticle is considered to be soft sci-fi. Less about characters though, than how a small society tends to deal with the changes in the world.

[q=snoopy369]I think the argument is that snotty professors use the definition to lessen the value of some novels as opposed to others.[/q]

That's exactly it.