America = 20th Century, Rest of World = 21st Century

[notyoueither]

I know. That's what makes you so funny, in a sad, sad sort of way.

[FrostyBoy]

Hm, but now I find you sad, and not in a funny way. That's gotta be even worse!

[FrostyBoy]

Did you fail to see that I made a joke about Singapore giving the local indians their own little town?

[notyoueither]

I didn't laugh at the punch-line.

I seldom giggle along with racists and bigots.

[notyoueither]

And then there are your curious views that new and shiny are signs of progress. Conspicuous consumption is superior, right?

All this, and you feel that your views define the 21st century.

Thanks for the laugh.

[FrostyBoy]

But i'm not racist, my girlfriend is chinese.
Did you ever see that Southpark show about the racism? Good episode.


Anyway, don't hold me back, what did I say that made me look so ignorant to you?

[Q Classic]

Well, if you have Yellow Fever, you're still racist.

[onodera]

By the way, if we're talking about inner city problems, is Detroit REALLY such a ****hole? I've seen some "before-after" photos and was amazed at how they let such a nice city (I love Art Deco) fall into disorder. Couldn't they just arrest all of the rioters, ship them into a reeducation cotton farm, er, camp and populate the city again with working people?
As far as I understand, every little place in the US has its own little budget, so when all working people moved out of the city, it went bankrupt? Wouldn't it be better to have consolidated state budgets, so suburbs would support the cities?

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Clearly it's time for the only person who's actually lived in both Chicago and Singapore to weigh in here.

Here's where Frosty's right: The US is very, very bad about investing in infrastructure upgrades, especially in cities. Our mass transit in particular is a joke. The truth is that the combo platter of (1) the movement of the middle class to the suburbs (2) the, um, ethnic nature of our cities, and (3) the remnants of a Jeffersonian suspicion of cities that has colored our whole country's history, all combine to give our cities the short shrift compared to Europe or Asia.

That being said, let's get serious about Singapore:

1) It's a rich, repressive police state. That's a much easier place to keep clean.
2) Its cost of living is approximately the same as Washington DC's, but the people who clean it -- from maids to road workers -- make under S$800 (US$550) a month for a six-day work week, or approximately US$2.85 and hour.
3) The cars are shiny, new -- and, thanks to import taxes, cost approximately 3 times what they would in the US. So there aren't that many on the road, and only prosperous people own them. Small wonder they're nice.
4) A city is and should be more than just shiny trains. Chicago has a world-class art museum, a world-class orchestra, a world-class aquarium, 5 professional sports teams with rabid followings, awesome live music scenes (rock, jazz, and blues), and the best architecture in the country. Singapore has a couple of ok museums and a kind of sad imitation of the Millenium Eye. edit: and a completely kick-ass zoo; DaShi's right about that.
5) Since anecdote seems to win the day here: Frosty may have been in a train car that smelled like ****, but I've actually been in a Singapore taxi when the cabbie whipped it out and took a piss in a 2-liter Coke bottle while taking me home. I admired his dexterity, but...yuck.

[Lancer]

Yuck is right, Pepsi is better.

I wonder if he did that because if he took a piss behind a tree he would be arrested and fined. Isn't that what they do when they spit?

[Tuberski]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly
Clearly it's time for the only person who's actually lived in both Chicago and Singapore to weigh in here.

Here's where Frosty's right: The US is very, very bad about investing in infrastructure upgrades, especially in cities. Our mass transit in particular is a joke. The truth is that the comb platter of (1) the movement of the middle class to the suburbs (2) the, um, ethnic nature of our cities, and (3) the remnants of a Jefforsonian suspicion of cities that has colored our whoel county's history all combine to give our cities the short shrift compared to Europe or Asia.

That being said, let's get serious about Singapore:

1) It's a rich, repressive police state. That's a much easier place to keep clean.
2) It's cost of living is approximately the same as Washington DCs, but teh people who clean it -- from maids to road workers -- make under S$800 (US$550) a month for a six-day work week, or approximately US$2.85 and hour.
3) The cars are shiny, new -- and, thanks to import taxes, cost approximately 3 times what they would in the US. So there aren't that many on the road, and only prosperous people own them. Small woner they're nice.
4) A city is and should be more than just shiny trains. Chicago has a world-class art museum, a world-class orchestra, a world-class aquarium, 5 professional sports teams with rabid followings, awesome live music scenes (rock, jazz, and blues), and the best architecture in the country. Singapore has a couple of ok museums and a kind of sad imitation of the Millenium Eye.
5) Since anecdote seems to win the day here: Frosty may have been in a train car that smelled liek ****, but I've actually been in a Singapore taxi in which the cabbie whipped it out and took a piss in a coke bottle while taking me home. I admired his dexterity, but...yuck.

I said the same thing with far less words.

ACK!

[Riesstiu IV]

Originally posted by onodera
By the way, if we're talking about inner city problems, is Detroit REALLY such a ****hole? I've seen some "before-after" photos and was amazed at how they let such a nice city (I love Art Deco) fall into disorder. Couldn't they just arrest all of the rioters, ship them into a reeducation cotton farm, er, camp and populate the city again with working people?
As far as I understand, every little place in the US has its own little budget, so when all working people moved out of the city, it went bankrupt? Wouldn't it be better to have consolidated state budgets, so suburbs would support the cities?

Except for a few suburbs, Detroit is really that bad. It's probably the worst city in the US. Detroit's mayor is Kwame Kilpatrick is said to be the first hip hop mayor in the world (and hopefully the last). Just look at his wikipedia page. 3/4 of it describes the various scandals he's been involved in.

Detroit came from a population of 2.2 million to around 800 thousand today. It's population loss is attributed to the decline of the auto industry and white flight following the 1967 race riots. There are areas of the city that are just completely abandoned and satellite maps have shown nature is gradually retaking many parts of the city.

A while ago, a came across an image of a book depository for the Detroit School District:





Looks like something out of war torn Chechnya.

[FrostyBoy]

Thanks Rufus, I was waiting your post.

Maids -
The indonesians make more money here than they do in their own country.

Cars
Singapore has a lot more cars than I would have thought, even not-well-to-do people and teens have them - and are modern, nice ones. Also, I think the high cost of cars is a good thing, can you imagine if it were easy to get a car in Singapore? Havoc!

LKY got Singapore to a "ready" state, a stage where everything is organised, modern, clean, accessible, etc. From this point on, it will develop the tourist industry, let's not forget the Singapore Zoo, Bird Park and upcoming Resorts (which will hold the world's largest oceanarium). World's best Airport and World's 2nd busiest port (or is it 3rd now?). I give Singapore another 20-30 years, you will start to see the culture here explode like fireworks.

[FrostyBoy]

Riesstiu. those HDR photos are amazing! Where can I get more and higher resolutions?

[Lancer]

With Detroit being taken over by nature someday it may be possible to grow food there. Of course the racists would kill you for just going there, but maybe that will change someday.