Fascist America, in 10 easy steps

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by Dry

Hitler wrote a book, Dubya read one book once, so Hitler > Bush.
[/troll]
* Dry runs away and hides

Can you prove this?

[Zevico]

You know, what if Bushy started up his own account on Poly? Don't you think he'd be pretty offended to read all these comments? I say we ban everyone that spoke a bad word about him, just in case. After all, we don't want to discourage anyone from joining do we? Gotta be newbie friendly these days.

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by Heraclitus
Actually the city-state of Athens is a good example, since any free adult male could vote. The US had slaves until the middle of the 19th century and women couldn’t vote until the 20th century (this is true of almost all countries).

Unless you are speaking of some era of Athenian history, that is not strictly true. You had to be a CITIZEN too, Athens had a lot of foreigners in it's walls for it's history.

I still think it is a good example of course, it ismy example after all.

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by Vesayen


Unless you are speaking of some era of Athenian history, that is not strictly true. You had to be a CITIZEN too, Athens had a lot of foreigners in it's walls for it's history.

I still think it is a good example of course, it ismy example after all.

I’m confused, does any country allow people who aren’t its citizens to vote? I didn't think it was nesecary to point that out...

[Vesayen]

There was no "naturalization" process(for the most part) in Athens. You were born Athenian or married in and even if you married in, you were not by default Athenian, but had to jump through beurocratic hoops many could not get through, you could not just become Athenian.

For much of it's history, Athens had a VERY large population of "aliens".

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by Vesayen
There was no "naturalization" process(for the most part) in Athens. You were born Athenian or married in and even if you married in, you were not by default Athenian, but had to jump through beurocratic hoops many could not get through, you could not just become Athenian.

For much of it's history, Athens had a VERY large population of "aliens".

That still doesn’t sound too different from many countries today.

[Vesayen]

It is not.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy
check

2. Create a gulag
it is still pretty small in size, but there to be used if need arises

3. Develop a thug caste
mercenaries are 50% of the western armed presence in Iraq - this is actually a good observation, will be interesting how will this force disband post Iraq, that is a lot of people out of work if that war stops. Again no threat but there to be used if needed.

4. Set up an internal surveillance system
check

5. Harass citizens' groups
is that at all important??? who listens to them anyhow...

6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release... why?
Don't see Americans do that yet, or ever, covered by next point...

7. Target key individuals
like Valerie Plame... well she was fair game

8. Control the press
only mainstream media... who reads other liberal trash like Guardian anyhow

9. Dissent equals treason
support the troops , not supporting is not treason formally yet either

10. Suspend the rule of law
need a nuke on one US city for that one...

Well it is not a bad collection of trends in US, it is a good setup if a major catastrophe happens, like a nuke, to make the shift into some sort of centralization of government... overall even if US goes autcratic, no biggie, not much will change, as long as they start performing well economically, noone from citizenry really cares who governs them and a reasonably small % of unlucky (dead) people never really bothered the mass at large.

China is autocratic and they love it. American Corporatocracy, more efficiency, more money, this party duopoly is pretty inefficient as it is anyhow

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by Vesayen
There was no "naturalization" process(for the most part) in Athens. You were born Athenian or married in and even if you married in, you were not by default Athenian, but had to jump through beurocratic hoops many could not get through, you could not just become Athenian.

For much of it's history, Athens had a VERY large population of "aliens".

If I remember corrrectly having a military training (and therefore be able to defend the city) was also one of the requirements to get voting rights.

Only natural, as the city states almost totaly depended on their fighting citizens (especially on those serving as hoplites in phalanxes)

[Vesayen]

That is not strictly true, though it was required that all citizens pay towards the defense of Athens via taxes.

[Dauphin]

My Greek history is poor, but Athenian democracy was not destroyed from within was it? It was after being defeated by the FYROM?

[One_more_turn]

If Bush were really that terrifying, he wouldn't be ridiculed left and right as it is now.

If Bush were really that terrifying, people would fear him and you would hardly hear any complaints about him in this country.

Now compare Bush to that Vladimir Putin guy, guess whom do you fear more?

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Dauphin
My Greek history is poor, but Athenian democracy was not destroyed from within was it? It was after being defeated by the FYROM?

I thought the Athenians lost their version of democracy as part of the peace terms imposed when they decisively lost the Peloponnesian War to the Spartans.

[Vesayen]

They did but it came back later.

However, Athens became quasi-facist many times in its democratic history as persuasive or powerful individuals came to power and subverted the democracy. Internal source, not, extenternal Dauphin.

[Reiko]

I have seen similar complaints of how America is becoming communist complete with the communist manifesto and a comparison of US laws to back it up.
It's all a bunch of BS. People focus on something bad they see in a government and run with it. Depending on you political viewpoint that government is either fascist or communist.