Race, Intelligence, & Genetics or How James Watson pissed off a lot of people.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Lorizael
...Who's doing the giving, Kid? Pilots either will or won't get such training as befits their needs, means, etc...

And really, that's an insignificant point. No matter what, in any field or position, you are going to have a pool of qualified candidates that vary in experience, ability, and skill - all qualified, but not equally so.

I think you are making too much of it.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Kontiki
Would you like to try for a third time to actually answer the question? You think it's the wrong policy now. How does this new evidence change things?

I stated that it doesn't, actually, since it is already the wrong policy.

[Kidlicious]

Waffle

[Jaguar]

Steven Levitt (author of Freakonomics) and Roland Fryer, another Harvard Economics guy, published a paper on this subject.

http://www.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/fryer/papers/fryer_levittbabiesrevision.pdf

They studied IQ tests given to children at the age of ~12 months (which is actually highly correlated with their intelligence as adults, in general.) They found that the races appear to be of even intelligence at that age, and that white children don't begin edging out minorities until later in life. This lends credence to the theory that the differences in intelligence are not innate, but products of the environment.

Using a newly available
nationally representative data set that includes a test of mental function for children aged
eight to twelve months, we find only minor racial differences in test outcomes (0.06
standard deviation units in the raw data) between Blacks and Whites that disappear with
the inclusion of a limited set of controls. Relative to Whites, children of all other races
lose ground by age two.

[VetLegion]

James D. Watson got lectures cancelled, his lab position suspended and his comments renounced by some influential scientists. He has apologized for his statements.

Case closed?

[Barnabas]

Hey Vet

I mentioned earlier in this thread thinking that once I discussed with you about this

-You saying that north-east asians (chinese, koreans, japanese were the smartest peopel)

-Me asking, if amerindians are deep down north east asians too, why do they not score as well

-You giving jews as an example of selection for high intelligence being making important changes in less than a millenium


Was I right or Have I confused another poster with you?

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by Jaguar They studied IQ tests given to children at the age of ~12 months (which is actually highly correlated with their intelligence as adults, in general.)

Jaguar?

How is children's intelligence as 12 month olds highly correlated with their intelligence as adults if at 12 months there is no difference between the groups compared, while in adulthood there is a significant difference? Do you understand the problem with your claim?

[Barnabas]

How do you test the intelligence of a 12 months baby?

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by Barnabas
Hey Vet

I mentioned earlier in this thread thinking that once I discussed with you about this

-You saying that north-east asians (chinese, koreans, japanese were the smartest peopel)

-Me asking, if amerindians are deep down north east asians too, why do they not score as well

-You giving jews as an example of selection for high intelligence being making important changes in less than a millenium


Was I right or Have I confused another poster with you?

You have not confused me with anyone, we have indeed discussed this. But you're attributing to me something I haven't said

Precisely: that Jews have been under selection for intelligence for about a millenium is not my claim, but Harpending, Cochran et. al. They wrote a paper about it. There is substantial evidence that Jewish emphasis on education is much older than their arrival into Europe, so selection for intelligence could also be much older (there is a paper about that you can download, but I don't have the link).

[Kidlicious]

I don't know if Jaguar read that the article. It says in the abstract that white children begin edging out blacks by age 2.

[Kidlicious]

I think the theory is that whites treat their children differently when they are between the ages of 8 months and 2 years old and older. That makes a different in intelligence as it is measured.

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by Barnabas
How do you test the intelligence of a 12 months baby?

According to the article linked to by Jaguar:

To measure mental proficiency, the ECLS-B uses an abbreviated version of the BSID known as the Bayley Short Form–Research Edition (BSF-R), which was designed to measure the development of children early in life in 5 broad areas: exploring objects (e.g., reaching for and holding objects), exploring objects with a purpose (e.g., trying to determine what makes the ringing sound in a bell), babbling expressively, early problem solving (e.g., when a toy is out of reach, using another object as a tool to retrieve the toy), and naming objects.

A child’s score is reported as a proficiency level, ranging from 0 to 1 on each of the five sections. These five proficiency scores have also been combined into an overall measure of cognitive ability using standard scale units. Most of our analysis focuses on this overall metric. The test is administered by a trained interviewer and takes twenty-five to thirty-five minutes to complete.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Barnabas
How do you test the intelligence of a 12 months baby?

I think it's probably a measure of their awareness, but maybe that's a coordination thing not related to mental ability.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by VetLegion


According to the article linked to by Jaguar:

To measure mental proficiency, the ECLS-B uses an abbreviated version of the BSID known as the Bayley Short Form–Research Edition (BSF-R), which was designed to measure the development of children early in life in 5 broad areas: exploring objects (e.g., reaching for and holding objects), exploring objects with a purpose (e.g., trying to determine what makes the ringing sound in a bell), babbling expressively, early problem solving (e.g., when a toy is out of reach, using another object as a tool to retrieve the toy), and naming objects.

A child’s score is reported as a proficiency level, ranging from 0 to 1 on each of the five sections. These five proficiency scores have also been combined into an overall measure of cognitive ability using standard scale units. Most of our analysis focuses on this overall metric. The test is administered by a trained interviewer and takes twenty-five to thirty-five minutes to complete.

I'm not sure that's a good test. A child could still be intelligent and not do any of those things.

[VetLegion]

Well, the test seems to have been conducted on a very large sample (10,000 kids) and I don't see any reason not to trust the conclusions. Kids of all races seem to score the same. The test is simple and perhaps not very g loaded but really, it's just little children, you can't really make them sit and take an exam