Muslim group places bounty of of 5,00,000 Rs. on the head of author critical of Islam

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Straybow

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
Where's the "unequivocical" voice of Americans against Abu Ghraib

We fired the General in charge and prosecuted guards who participated. That's called "unequivocal."

Yes, and you reelected the politicians that had given the military the let-go. "Unequivocical"

The reality is that people, for obvious cultural reasons, are never as critical of their own as they are of others

I seem to see tons of people in the West critical of the West and fawning over the bloody murderers in Islamism. What do you see?

So critical indeed that they reelect Bush.

Want a better example? how about you compare media coverage of 9/11 to that of the victims of "collateral damage" in Iraq?

And yes, if you try to open your mind to Muslim culture, you will see that there's, amongst them, a healthy debate about the issues that the world faces.

BS. I've been studying Islam for fifteen years and you have to get a microscope to find "debate" on issues.

Wow

[Sprayber]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris


You can do better than quoting Wikipedia quoting the Jerusalem Center for Public affairs, an article by Newt Gingrich, and an obscure Reuters release from 2000, can't you?.

Lord of the Mark has been more successful in showing muslims who speak out against terrorism in a few posts than you have in the whole thread and all you can do is question him about using wiki as a source? All you have done is ramble on about excuses and insults against the west while he has actually provided postive muslim voices.

Shouldn't really be a surprise though..

[Straybow]

Originally posted by lord of the mark

Originally posted by Straybow
Poll? Who cares... Where is even the one, loud, unequivocal voice of condemnation from a native, "mainstream" Muslim?

AFAICT "mainstream"? As opposed to what, a Druze? A shia?

Im not sure what the qualifiers mean.

id suggest Zalmay Khalilzad, or Hamid Kharzai. Do Afghans not count? Im sure I could come up with some more pretty quickly.

Heck, there was one Imam in Italy, who thought that the Koran showed the Jews have a right to the land of Israel. I guess I will have to go look him up.

This guy:
http://www.aish.com/Israel/articles/..._Viewpoint.asp

Correct: Khalilzad, Kharzai, or a scholar in Italy don't count as "mainstream" Islam. The same way the CofE Bishops and Ivy League religion professors who don't believe in the virgin birth and divinity of Christ don't count as "mainstream" Christian voices.

The average Muslim would rather believe that 9/11 was a Mossad or CIA plot (or both) than face the ugly truth that 19 of their own fellow Muslims are murderous wackos. Much less the tens of thousands of jihadis who feel called to martyrdom.

Where is the committee of 150 scholars, doctors, lawyers, and engineers who release a condemnation of this fatwah because they see themselves as the true voice of Islam? Those who hold such views know they are in the tiniest of minorities.

[Drake Tungsten]

$10,000? Anyone know this chick's last known location?

[Barnabas]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
It's people's actions that show their true belief. Don't forget, most Muslim countries aren't liberal democracies where self expression is valued - and where everyone would get their little personal satisfaction, as a citizen, by denouncing anti-environmentalist policies and then driving their cars to work every morning thereafter.

Why are all muslims countries like that then?
Can all muslim countries be like that against the wishes of the majority of the population? or maybe most of the population think that is fine?

[Fake Boris]

Clearly the USSR was a tyranny because the people wanted it

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Sprayber


Lord of the Mark has been more successful in showing muslims who speak out against terrorism in a few posts than you have in the whole thread and all you can do is question him about using wiki as a source? All you have done is ramble on about excuses and insults against the west while he has actually provided postive muslim voices.

Shouldn't really be a surprise though..

I'm not questioning the use of Wiki, I'm questioning the sources of the Wiki article in question. Try again, harder.

As for the "presence" or "absence" of debate and culture in Muslim countries, I'm not about to positively demonstrate it - it's something you can observe by reading sources with an open mind. If you're too asinine to get an education on your own, the best I can do is feel sorry for you.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Straybow
The average Muslim would rather believe that 9/11 was a Mossad or CIA plot (or both) than face the ugly truth that 19 of their own fellow Muslims are murderous wackos. Much less the tens of thousands of jihadis who feel called to martyrdom.

a) it's not that much of a mainstream opinion
b) seeing the lies against Islam being propagated on a daily basis in the Western media, I could at least *understand* that some Muslims would imagine you capable of such a machination. Sad, but comprehensible.

Where is the committee of 150 scholars, doctors, lawyers, and engineers who release a condemnation of this fatwah because they see themselves as the true voice of Islam? Those who hold such views know they are in the tiniest of minorities.

Why would they? Do I issue a statement every ****ing time the Pope says something retarded? Sometimes you just go on with life - what you guys are doing is projecting your own fictitious problem on them and assuming their "silence" is complacency, while in reality this silence is a) not as much of a silence you think it is and b) the fact that you don't have to take responsibility for everything that happens on a ****ing daily basis.

[Fake Boris]

Remember what happened after no WMDs were found in Iraq, or the Guantanamo/Abu Ghraib scandals?

The first reaction on these boards - and others - was a stream of denial. When it became evident that the accusations had indeed a solid basis, the tone slowly shifted - people started arguing on the definition of torture, defended "selective" torture, and contended that the lieutenants had been punished (while in reality there's strong evidence that the orders came right from the top). This is typical Machiavellianism - hand the dirty work to a subordinate, and then repudiate him when the **** hits the fan.

I can very well see similar denial amongst certain groups of Muslims, but certainly nothing worthy of the current hysteria that's akin to a neoconservative djihad. If anything, it's the same kind of self-congratulation and denial amongst Americans that has lead them to tolerate the unacceptable - death of thousands of civilians, oppression of Palestinians, torture.

As much as I reject the notion that the victims of 9/11 were guilty by "association", I reject the gross simplifications about the "Muslim world" that make 1 billion humans of radically diverse origin and culture "guilty" by association.

The difference is that the words of American extremists are backed by ICBMs and 700B$ in military spendings, while those of Muslim fanatics are backed by peasant militias armed with AK-47s. As far as I'm concerned, I know which side I fear the most.

[aneeshm]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
Clearly the USSR was a tyranny because the people wanted it

Remind me of the last time the Communist party was elected to power in the USSR in a free and fair election, with a credible opposition also existing, would you?

[Fake Boris]

You have just surpassed yourself, Aneeshm.

[dannubis]

Originally posted by Drixnak
I never claimed to be educated, I simply claimed to be smarter than you. A fact that has been proven in this short conversation.

The concept of an intelligent discussion, which you obviously fail to grasp, is based on two or more people exchanging ideas.

You on the other hand put some wild dogmas on the table and expect people to treat you seriously. Then when you are ignored you claim victory. You don't seem very smart to me, just another redneck with an attitude problem...

[EyesOfNight]

The concept of an intelligent discussion, which you obviously fail to grasp, is based on two or more people exchanging ideas.

You on the other hand put some wild dogmas on the table and expect people to treat you seriously. Then when you are ignored you claim victory. You don't seem very smart to me, just another redneck with an attitude problem...

I'm sorry, where did I say this was intelligent discussion? I've made it very clear that I don't feel you are on a level to engage in "intelligent" discussion with me. Again, I simply claimed that I am smarter than you. Why are you having so much trouble understanding this? As for the redneck comment...you should really understand who you're talking to before you start using the standard Apolyton insults for anyone who isn't communist loving, weak minded Euroscum.

[Fake Boris]

Drixnass lacks the drive of an intelligent troll.

[Arrian]

EoN was never particularly creative. He just insults others intelligence, without displaying any himself.

-Arrian