Good riddance to bad rubbish - 15 years since USSR dissolved!

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Tassi
Freedom

Yes, exactly. It was a good thing that Russia was forced to stop strangling the aspirations of the States that once comprised the USSR.

Freedom to starve
Freedom to be poisoned
Freedom to oppress others

It's also quite a sad thing that Russia has chosen to return to the path of oppression and fear at the hands of teh Putin. But that shouldn't damper the joy of states like Lithuania.

[lord of the mark]

at this point its good to remember, that, whatever criticisms we have of Putin, Russians too are much freer than they were under the USSR, and Putin retains his popularity because while he seems to represent greater strength and order, he does so without going all the way back to the oppression that charecterized the USSR even in late "moderate" phase.

As Serb has reminded us, there are open opposition publications in Putins Russia. Not so in the USSR till the last years of Peretroika. There are opposition parties of various stripes - not true in the USSR even under Gorbachev.

[KrazyHorse]

he does so without going all the way back to the oppression that charecterized the USSR even in late "moderate" phase.

Not yet.

[Nubclear]

The introduction of greater freedoms into most of the former Soviet Union is of course a good thing. The problem is the way in which it was handled: Instead of reforming the Soviet Union and turning it into a nice democracy, the Soviet Union was instead smashed entirely.

This allowed for poverty and radicalism to take hold in many of the former Soviet republics, and is most notable in Russia: The rise of ultranationalism within Russia is likely a direct consequence in the way the collapse of the Soviet Union was handled and everyone, especially the Russian people, will likely feel the consequences of that particular policy decision well into the future.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Tassi
The introduction of greater freedoms into most of the former Soviet Union is of course a good thing. The problem is the way in which it was handled: Instead of reforming the Soviet Union and turning it into a nice democracy, the Soviet Union was instead smashed entirely.

This allowed for poverty and radicalism to take hold in many of the former Soviet republics, and is most notable in Russia: The rise of ultranationalism within Russia is likely a direct consequence in the way the collapse of the Soviet Union was handled and everyone, especially the Russian people, will likely feel the consequences of that particular policy decision well into the future.

In December of 1991 it wasnt clear that there was any way to shake off the Apparatus, and avoid new coups, than to break up the USSR. Thats why the presidents of Russia, Belarus and Ukraine agreed to do it, cause of the status of the Union govt.

In any case, the Baltics would probably have left anyway. If the other ex-SSRs want to rejoin, they can, as Belarus virtually has. That they havent suggests that they dont see it as in their interests.

[Solver]

Good riddance .

[Pekka]

Solver, how about the new.. head of defense in Estonia? That dude sure didn't save any words, I mean why didn't he say what he really meant!?

Yes, I bet he said what was on his mind, however, I just dont' see why you would go on an verbal attack like that in your very first day. That just doesn't seem sensible to me, in fact I don't think it's his JOB to do that.

I'm definitely not saying he should kiss any butts... but he doesn't have to rip new buttholes to people either, especially when there's no active situation where it kind of fits the whole big picture.

[Kuciwalker]

[Solver]

Pekka, the only source I've seen mention that, uhm, speech, was lenta.ru, a Russian site that hates the Baltic countries with a passion. I'd like to see if there's another source before I comment.

[TCO]

fvck the commies, and the che t-shirt wearing fellow travelers

[Lancer]

Thank you Ronald Reagan!

*ducks*

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
It's funny how people still celebrate the freedoms from the USSR at a time where freedoms in the west are being drained away.

There is a relationship between those. As long as the USSR existed as an alternative, the West had to treat its poorer members with dignity. Now that "There Is No Alterniatve" we're all screwed.

[DaShi]

Ever get the feeling that Che just makes some of this stuff up as he goes along?

[Jaguar]

Shouldn't this be in the history forum?

[KrazyHorse]

You never thanked me for helping you with your homework.