Damn anti smoking fanatics! Bars can't serve food and allow smoking? WTF!

[Asher]

Originally posted by Mrs. Tuberski
Asher if the estrablishment allows smoking why would i leave??? your the one, the non smoker with ur panties in a wad you leave!!! I have the same rights you have and i choose to do as i please with them as you do.

You reallllllly don't get it.

Since the establishment bans smoking, you're very welcome to leave. Hell, boycott. That'll show us.

Non-smokers are upset that your stupid-ass habit is affecting their health all because you're too lazy to take it outside. Selfish, arrogant mother****ers, them smokers.

[Ben Kenobi]

It was your choice to go out and drink? If you want to smoke why not stay in and have a great party with your friends. It ain't hard.

If a stiff like me can pull it off so can you

Sure. If all bars want to be non-smoking, I won't go to them. That's their business decision. I'm not the one insisting all bars should be smoking.

Oh, and I fail to see why you have to insult folks to advance your argument Asher. Does it make you feel like a bigger man?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Asher
And for the record, I think it should be illegal for cars to be driven in restaurants and bars as well. The fumes are also harmful to humans, and should only be done outside...

I made that joke already.

[greenday_234]

Last time I checked, global warming and gas prices don't cause cancer.

No your right they don't. They just cause biodome shifts, mass flooding, starvation and a future economic crash on a greater proportion than that of the Great Depression. Your right...at least it doesn't cause cancer. Wheww, and I thought it was going to be bad.

I'm pretty sure that most people's priority would be on their own health before the health of the planet and their money.

That is clearly true, but I think its stupid. Seeing as the health of their planet is their health as well. Tell me, where else are they going to move to?

Second-hand smoke does.

I think that is indeed true, but not to the degree that most people claim it is. I think its only a hazard to those who have to work around it on a day to day basis. When you go out on a friday night and inhale second-hand smoke for an evening its not going to give you cancer. If it did, I don't know how we're all still alive seeing all the **** we breathe in on a day to day basis from factories, automobiles not to mention whats in the foods we eat, the water we drink and so on.

Concerning those who have to work around second-hand smoke, well I think thats where the strongest arguement lies. However, in this particular case I don't think the government has a complete and total right to intervene. I believe they have the right and obligation to do 3 things: adopt Universal Healthcare, for a thousand different reasons, second they have the right mandate that smoking bars put signs up letting patrons know and to levee a tax against bars/restaurants that decide to go for smoking.

The main reason I'm against a smoking ban is because I work in a bar in a fairly small town. 99% of people who come into our bar are smokers. The county has just past a ban on smoking and the fact is now we're going to have anywhere from 50 people on a slow night to 200 on a good night out in the streets...drunk...standing next to vehicles and smoking. Its hard enough to police our bar to begin with, now what are we supposed to do? Leave it up to the police department to handle it? Do we really want to put the resources of our police department behind this when they could be doing other more important things? I don't think so. My point here is that what works in some places doesn't work in others. So I think the best option is to go with a tax. Its easier and it'll bring in some revenue to continue to find cures for cancer, fund our schools etc.

As far as the SUV issue I still believe that to be true, however abrasively I stated it before. I'm sorry but I find nothing more hypocratical than my fellow citizens *****ing about smoke and then climbing into Lincoln Navigators or Escalades. Certainly small SUV's are okay but there is no reason to have an automobile the size of a WWI tank. If I'm a scorge on society when I light up then so are those who drive unnecessarilly large automobiles. It is the oil crisis that threatens our national security, it is oil that the threatens our environment and it is oil that bogs down our economy. Frankly its time we start looking at these things as well, because I'm tired of constantly being attacked for my habits will many others get a free pass.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Sure. If all bars want to be non-smoking, I won't go to them. That's their business decision. I'm not the one insisting all bars should be smoking.

Oh, and I fail to see why you have to insult folks to advance your argument Asher.

Who's insulting folks? The arguments behind permitting the minority to smoke in public places to the detriment of the whole of the public are not supportable by any reasonable means.

The public has decided that in concerns for public health, smoking is not to be allowed inside.

Why is it that you radical righties get all upset about "advocate judges" that make rules, that you insist it should be up to the people...then when the people make rules you ***** and complain?

Smokers are in the minority. Smoking affects everyone around them. Smoking in public places is bad, mmkay.

[Ming]

Originally posted by Asher
I take the subway to/from work each day.

But do you ever drive a car? Because when you do, you are poluting the planet, and helping to kill us all. So I hope you never plan on being selfish in the future by ever driving a car again

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ming
True enough

But driving a car is helping to kill EVERYBODY on the planet. There is no excaping it. So Asher, stop being so selfish and stop driving your car. Because of you, people are dying!

This is perhaps the worst argument in the thread -- I should only hope it's tongue-in-cheek...

[Ming]

Originally posted by Asher
Smokers are in the minority.

Gee... aren't gays a minority too? I guess you don't mind then when people make laws saying being gay is illegal simply because you are a minority

[MRT144]

mrs tubes if the public wills the ban on drinking then i will comply but i will fight that change. you want to subvert the will of the people and the debate of the subject.

for a public ban on booze youd first have to convince a majority of its wrongness and then figure out a way to enforce it without the costs outweighing the benefits. the costs of banning smoking far outweigh the costs because th right still exsists.

i dont think smokers and non smokers are selfish because they want to change or maintain a situation that they enjoy or dislike.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ming
But do you ever drive a car? Because when you do, you are poluting the planet, and helping to kill us all. So I hope you never plan on being selfish in the future by ever driving a car again

Can you please stop being facetious to derail the argument?

I hope you actually realize that driving a car does not, in fact, kill people by polluting the air. It does contribute to global warming, but that doesn't kill people.

This is why your argument is beyond stupid:

1) I am not advocating banning smoking, merely asking for it to be done outside rather than in a public indoor place. This removes the basis of your car/smoking comparison completely, 'cause cars shouldn't be running indoors in public places either...
2) Pollution from a car does not, in fact, kill people -- directly or indirectly

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ming
Gee... aren't gays a minority too? I guess you don't mind then when people make laws saying being gay is illegal simply because you are a minority

I didn't think you'd be...special...enough to try this argument.

I'm not making my argument against smoking on the basis of:
1) JESUS says...
2) I think it's icky

I'm making my argument on the basis of:
1) The act of smoking directly impacts the health of the people near the smoker

There is a huge difference between civil rights and between addicts who don't care about the welfare of the people around them.

If you want to compare the persecution of the poor, poor smokers to that of homosexuals, be my guest...

[Ben Kenobi]

Gee... aren't gays a minority too? I guess you don't mind then when people make laws saying being gay is illegal simply because you are a minority

Well said ming.

[greenday_234]

how can we tell child molesters where to live and where not to unless their mere presence is a threat to public safety?

How dare you compare smokers to child molestors in regards to property rights. That statement is on par with low-lifes who compare gay marriage to allowing people to marry dogs. They are two seperate issues and how dare you try to make the comparison that they are one in the same.

I'm a smoker, I smoke in my house. I respect people when they ask me to put out my cigarette in public places. I don't touch children and I don't rape them either.

Move on and and get a life.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Asher
I hope you actually realize that driving a car does not, in fact, kill people by polluting the air. It does contribute to global warming, but that doesn't kill people.

Actually, it does. In areas with certain conditions cars contribute to the smog that leads to premature death for many people with lung conditions, or to them developing lung conditions that will lead to premature death.

[Mrs. Tuberski]

no asher the sad part is that you dont get it...... I dont go into a br that doenst allow smoking and smoke, i dont smoke wher it says no smoking, if u walk into my filed of being i have just as much right to be there as u do and im not gonna throw my back out cause u got ur nuts in a twist. if i was there first who the hell are u to tell me what i can and cant do if its allowed by law??