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I really doubt people know about Warsaw uprising.
Germans have felt the bitter result of a lost war, true. But in comparison to that they've started the war with all the deliberation, that they've treaten people east to their boarders as animals, in comparison with all their atrocities, their fate after ww2 is very lucky, especially that other, completely innocent or much less guilty, suffered the same or worse.
That doesn't mean You can or should not speak about it.
But with great, great caution
Because some may think it's like if a serial killer was complaining he was treated harshly by the police on the way to prison
Not Russian, but Soviet.
It upsets me because
a) it is mostly not accompanied by depictions of sufferings of others
b) because Jews, especially American and Israeli ones, are exploiting the memory of their nation's tragedy for political gain without limits. That is why Israel has no compassion for sufferings of others. That's why Israel and many Jews are so pro-turkish in armenian case, or so biased against Poles.
I am glad You mentioned Romas and gays etc., because it reminded me something
Some time ago there's been an anniversary of liberation of Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration camp.
European Parliament prepared a proclamation for this anniversary, in which the prisoners of Auschwitz-Birkenau were depicted as "Jews, Romas and gays".
Only after polish intervention, Poles and Soviet prisoners of war were added. It is a scandal, in my opinion. Poles were the second biggest population among Auschwitz-Birkenau's victims, 7% or so. That's a dozen times less than Jews, but much. Soviets were the third most numerable. Yet, the elite of Europe forgot about them, but remembered about marginal in numbers Romas and gays.
In world press, especially in American, "polish concentration camp" term is being used, and indeed many people think Poles were the ones killing Jews. I remember a Bulgarian poster, was it Sir Og or someone else, wanted to offend me by saying we, Poles, killed Jews in our concentration camp. I corrected him, he accepted it, OK.
But it is more than that!
My first or second thread at Apolyton OT, once again I recall, was forced by an Israeli poster who, by the way of Eurovision contest, stated that "Germany, Poland and Austria should vote for us (Israel), until the number of their votes reaches 6 million"
And it's not only that. Again I recall when our ministry of foreign affaird, W. Bartoszewicz, a prisoner of Auschwitz himself, had to explain to someone during his trip to Israel, that concentration camps "were not possible in Poland because of consent of local polish population"
etc
If Israelis don't know what was happening in Europe during ww2, I really doubt rest of the world does.
After all, I wouldn't dare to think Israel hasn't got a good educational system, especially in this matter, or that it is teaching them not true on purpouse.
[quote]
Yes, at least the lands in Greater Germany (Germany incl. Austria + Bohemia + territories annected and General Gubern in Poland + etc) though it was rather seen as a long-distance plan, so Poles weren't killed at once, but treated as slave labour
This link: it's 3 million, not 1,4-1,9. Unless those people vanished in the air.
Edit:
I am completely aware there were some sporadic examples of atrocities of Poles against Jews or Germans during and immediatelly after ww2. They are often exagerrated, Jews tend to treat any attack I find cases like Kielce pogrom or Lambinowice camp for Germans evil, wrong and shameful. Poland has trialed or trials people responsible for them, though actually when it comes to polish-jewish history there's only a one point of which I am actually ashamed as a Pole, it is 1968, though my family was the victim of the occurances of that year.
Oh, and an interesting case
To make the story short: after ww2, Poles and Jews commited crimes against Germans. One of the most responsible fled to Israel, which is rejecting extradition
Please notice, that in the first case the first we see areconcentration camp prisoners, bah, children, and a note that Morel lost many relatives in concentration camps.
In the second case, Morel's family losses were put to the front as well.
Indeed, as IPN (polish Institute of National Memory) official said, war criminals should be judged are they german or jewish, or polish - I may add.
Yet, a case like Morel's on one side, and as his victims on the other may force someone to forget about the proportions of fault during ww2 era. That's why I am very touchy when it comes to Germans complaining about their losses.
Perhaps too touchy.
Sorry if I've offended someone, am willing to discuss
bye
Germans have felt the bitter result of a lost war, true. But in comparison to that they've started the war with all the deliberation, that they've treaten people east to their boarders as animals, in comparison with all their atrocities, their fate after ww2 is very lucky, especially that other, completely innocent or much less guilty, suffered the same or worse.
That doesn't mean You can or should not speak about it.
But with great, great caution
Because some may think it's like if a serial killer was complaining he was treated harshly by the police on the way to prison
Originally posted by lord of the mark
Most works on the holocaust Ive read give plenty of attention to Roma, Poles, Russian POWs, etc. Lately theres been new focus on the plight of gays. Im sorry if the added attention to a group that the Germans wanted to exterminate to the last man woman and child, and that was hunted down all across europe, and that was central to Nazi ideology, that Hitler talked about in his last will, etc upsets you.
Most works on the holocaust Ive read give plenty of attention to Roma, Poles, Russian POWs, etc. Lately theres been new focus on the plight of gays. Im sorry if the added attention to a group that the Germans wanted to exterminate to the last man woman and child, and that was hunted down all across europe, and that was central to Nazi ideology, that Hitler talked about in his last will, etc upsets you.
It upsets me because
a) it is mostly not accompanied by depictions of sufferings of others
b) because Jews, especially American and Israeli ones, are exploiting the memory of their nation's tragedy for political gain without limits. That is why Israel has no compassion for sufferings of others. That's why Israel and many Jews are so pro-turkish in armenian case, or so biased against Poles.
I am glad You mentioned Romas and gays etc., because it reminded me something
Some time ago there's been an anniversary of liberation of Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration camp.
European Parliament prepared a proclamation for this anniversary, in which the prisoners of Auschwitz-Birkenau were depicted as "Jews, Romas and gays".
Only after polish intervention, Poles and Soviet prisoners of war were added. It is a scandal, in my opinion. Poles were the second biggest population among Auschwitz-Birkenau's victims, 7% or so. That's a dozen times less than Jews, but much. Soviets were the third most numerable. Yet, the elite of Europe forgot about them, but remembered about marginal in numbers Romas and gays.
In world press, especially in American, "polish concentration camp" term is being used, and indeed many people think Poles were the ones killing Jews. I remember a Bulgarian poster, was it Sir Og or someone else, wanted to offend me by saying we, Poles, killed Jews in our concentration camp. I corrected him, he accepted it, OK.
But it is more than that!
My first or second thread at Apolyton OT, once again I recall, was forced by an Israeli poster who, by the way of Eurovision contest, stated that "Germany, Poland and Austria should vote for us (Israel), until the number of their votes reaches 6 million"
And it's not only that. Again I recall when our ministry of foreign affaird, W. Bartoszewicz, a prisoner of Auschwitz himself, had to explain to someone during his trip to Israel, that concentration camps "were not possible in Poland because of consent of local polish population"
etc
If Israelis don't know what was happening in Europe during ww2, I really doubt rest of the world does.
After all, I wouldn't dare to think Israel hasn't got a good educational system, especially in this matter, or that it is teaching them not true on purpouse.
[quote]
Originally posted by Brachy-Pride
He also wanted to exterminate slavs, to empty their lands, and repopulate them with the german race, if I recall correctly
He also wanted to exterminate slavs, to empty their lands, and repopulate them with the german race, if I recall correctly
This link: it's 3 million, not 1,4-1,9. Unless those people vanished in the air.
Edit:
I am completely aware there were some sporadic examples of atrocities of Poles against Jews or Germans during and immediatelly after ww2. They are often exagerrated, Jews tend to treat any attack I find cases like Kielce pogrom or Lambinowice camp for Germans evil, wrong and shameful. Poland has trialed or trials people responsible for them, though actually when it comes to polish-jewish history there's only a one point of which I am actually ashamed as a Pole, it is 1968, though my family was the victim of the occurances of that year.
Oh, and an interesting case
To make the story short: after ww2, Poles and Jews commited crimes against Germans. One of the most responsible fled to Israel, which is rejecting extradition
Please notice, that in the first case the first we see areconcentration camp prisoners, bah, children, and a note that Morel lost many relatives in concentration camps.
In the second case, Morel's family losses were put to the front as well.
Indeed, as IPN (polish Institute of National Memory) official said, war criminals should be judged are they german or jewish, or polish - I may add.
Yet, a case like Morel's on one side, and as his victims on the other may force someone to forget about the proportions of fault during ww2 era. That's why I am very touchy when it comes to Germans complaining about their losses.
Perhaps too touchy.
Sorry if I've offended someone, am willing to discuss
bye
:year 2000 like-Heresson mode:
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