NHL Offseason: All 10 weeks of it

[Asher]

Both are GMs for team that haven't ever won the cup, or haven't won the cup in 40 years. Says a lot, I think.

As for the Roloson deal, it'll come to bite the Oilers in the ass and hard. Markkanen will be the #1 by the end of the next season, provided our good buddy MacTavish doesn't destroy him again.

Long-term contracts on old players, under a salary cap, is remarkably stupid.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Asher

Are you KIDDING ME? The Leafs overpayed McCabe, Kaberle, and now they're overpaying Kubina. All of them are offensive defensemen with average, AT BEST, defensive games.

Only you would look at a defencemen who averages 35 points and call him an offensive defence.

Kubina has proven his worth as a defencemen, particularly when the Lightning won the cup and the Flames lost. You do remember the Flames losing.

You got to stop living in a dream world and recognize what the market is paying for quality players.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by notyoueither
How many people can you sign at $2mil a year for a journeyman?

What will it cost to get a veteran player with proven leadership qualities and strong defensive-forward abilities.

About $2 million.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Asher
Both are GMs for team that haven't ever won the cup, or haven't won the cup in 40 years. Says a lot, I think.

As for the Roloson deal, it'll come to bite the Oilers in the ass and hard. Markkanen will be the #1 by the end of the next season, provided our good buddy MacTavish doesn't destroy him again.

Long-term contracts on old players, under a salary cap, is remarkably stupid.

Apparently only if they are 35 when they sign the contract. But again, it is unlikely the Oilers want to spend the cap, so having a year or two of Rolie without Rolie shouldn't have that large an impact. *knocks on wood*

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Tingkai


What will it cost to get a veteran player with proven leadership qualities and strong defensive-forward abilities.

About $2 million.

Toronto is over 33mil on 15 players.

Vancouver is over 36mil on 11 players.

Both are seriously screwed by the thinking that you can pay a journeyman 2mil a year, and then go up from there.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Only you would look at a defencemen who averages 35 points and call him an offensive defence.

He's certainly not a defensive defenseman, or if he is he's absolutely terrible at it with a -12. Kubina is -98 overall in his NHL career so far. You overpaid, buddy.

You've got this obsession with stats. Have you ever watched these guys play? Kubina has classified as an offensive defenseman by his playstyle, he's certainly not defense-first...he takes lots of offensive risks. I wouldn't even rank him in the top 20 defensemen in the league, so what you're paying him is way too much.

You got to stop living in a dream world and recognize what the market is paying for quality players.

What certain teams in the market are paying for players, I recognize. It doesn't mean it's a good deal.

Similarly, the people who buy $10,000 Alienware PCs are overpaying and would be better off spending their money elsewhere. IMO, two well-picked $2M defenseman would have a larger impact than Kubina. There's some GMs in the league, Nonis and JFJ in particular, that don't seem to know how to budget their money or spend it intelligently. They don't seem to understand value.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Tingkai
What will it cost to get a veteran player with proven leadership qualities and strong defensive-forward abilities.

About $2 million.

Veteran = geriatric? Another NHLer who should be retired that'll show up on Toronto's lineup.

JR, Toronto will pay you $6M a season.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Asher

Veteran = geriatric? Another NHLer who should be retired that'll show up on Toronto's lineup.

29-year-old = geriatric ?????

Yeah, right.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Asher
He's certainly not a defensive defenseman, or if he is he's absolutely terrible at it with a -12. Kubina is -98 overall in his NHL career so far.

You've got this obsession with stats.

Classic. Kettle, meet pot.

Kubina is neither a stay-at-home defencemen, nor an offensive defence. He can play both games well and he has the stamina to play many shifts night after night while performing at a high level. He's also brings Stanley Cup experience to the blue line. Plus he's got experience playing with Kaberle.

Top 20? Maybe, but definitely with Kubina, Toronto has three of the top 35 defencemen, an above average number of quality defencemen.

This is what the player index thing has to say about Kubina:
ASSETS: Has good size and knows how to use it. Possesses a terrific low shot from the point and is a solid point producer. Can log plenty of minutes.

FLAWS: Still needs to gain more maturity. Must take charge and become the undisputed leader of the blueline brigade.

CAREER POTENTIAL: No. 2 defenseman.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Top 20? Maybe, but definitely with Kubina, Toronto has three of the top 35 defencemen, an above average number of quality defencemen.

ASSETS: Has good size and knows how to use it. Possesses a terrific low shot from the point and is a solid point producer. Can log plenty of minutes.

FLAWS: Still needs to gain more maturity. Must take charge and become the undisputed leader of the blueline brigade.

CAREER POTENTIAL: No. 2 defenseman.

Top 30 D is worth 5mil a year?

These numbers don't crunch with the salary cap.

It is possible Toronto will go a long way with the best defence in hockey (they better hope it's the best for what they're paying for it). Toronto still has a little room.

Some of the other teams in this frenzy are well and truely screwed (Vancouver, unless some White Knight comes and takes Naslund's contract off them).

[Tingkai]

An indication of how good the Kubina and Gill deals are, read Damien Cox's column about it.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1151791810881&call_pageid=1044442959412&col=1044442957278

Cox is always hard-nose about the Leaf with highly critical analysis that is usually dead on target. For him to be praising the two deals says a lot.

[notyoueither]

Since the end of the season, he has fired Pat Quinn and Rick Ley, hired Maurice, chopped Tie Domi, said goodbye to Belfour, moved a top goalie prospect for Raycroft and now spent $26 million on two experienced defencemen.

He doesn't have a contract, don't forget, beyond this season.

If he's going to go down, apparently he's going down swinging.

We'll see.

Very bold, I'll give him that.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Tingkai
An indication of how good the Kubina and Gill deals are, read Damien Cox's column about it.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1151791810881&call_pageid=1044442959412&col=1044442957278

Cox is always hard-nose about the Leaf with highly critical analysis that is usually dead on target. For him to be praising the two deals says a lot.

Are you kidding? Cox is considered a complete loon over here, from the columns we see on ESPN...

He's the guy that advocated at the start of the season that the only stat for goaltenders that matters is "Wins": http://proxy.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?id=2206624

Raycroft had 8 wins and 19 losses last year.
So what did he have to say when Raycroft was signed? Obviously this is "encouraging"! And it shows JFJ has balls, he's bold!

Cox is a guy that spins for Toronto when the public wants hope, and then rails against the Leafs when the public wants heads to roll. He's a popular column guy in Toronto for that reason, he extends the sentiment of the fans so they're happy when they read his column. He's a cook when it comes to hockey.

[notyoueither]

You can win championships on defence.

The question at the beginning of the year is, do you have the right defence?

I'm doubting a slapt together, highest bidder version.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Asher
Cox is a guy that spins for Toronto when the public wants hope, and then rails against the Leafs when the public wants heads to roll.

You obviously don't read Cox's columns very often. He rarely ever has anything good to say about the Leafs, focusing on their problems and rarely ever acknowledging the good points. That's his job and that's what Leafs fans prefer, rather than the cheerleading types.

And from the parts of the column about goalie stats that I have read, he's not arguing that "the only stat for goaltenders that matters is "Wins"."

He's talking about how the Vezina trophy should be decided, particularly given that there is a trophy for lowest GAA so it would not make sense to hand out a second trophy for lowest GAA.

Read the column before you *****.

As for Raycroft, he's judged on more than what he did in the last season. He's judged on his abilities and potential. Cujo was written off before he joined the leafs and he put up stellar results. Belfour was written off, but came back to win.

You really need to take off your blinders.