Men Want Say in Unplanned Pregnancy!

[Az]

If men have the right to arbitrarily sever their financial rights to children they don't want at or before birth, it will encourage irresponsible behavior on the part of men, since they know that no matter what, they can't be stuck with the bill/responsibility. No need to wear a condom. No need to ensure she's on the pill. Just walk away.

Why should men be held to more responsiblity than women on the issue?

[Az]

Wow, some people here are really irresponsible. Who cares if the dumb b1tch didn't take the pill and forgot to tell you? There's a ****ing CHILD born in THIS world who needs parents and care, that you made, so you better get up your ass and move instead of filing legal complaints.

appeal to emotion noted and duly discarded.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Az

If men have the right to arbitrarily sever their financial rights to children they don't want at or before birth, it will encourage irresponsible behavior on the part of men, since they know that no matter what, they can't be stuck with the bill/responsibility. No need to wear a condom. No need to ensure she's on the pill. Just walk away.

Why should men be held to more responsiblity than women on the issue?

Women are left with the consequences regardless. If men simply run away, than they are being held less responsible than the woman is on the issue. Che is advocating that men be made to deal with the consequences just as the woman has to, so that they are both responsible.

[Fake Boris]

If less men thought like you guys, there would be much less moany idiots in the world, having to read Paulo Coelho in order to give a meaning to their quest for the Lost Parent.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Az

Wow, some people here are really irresponsible. Who cares if the dumb b1tch didn't take the pill and forgot to tell you? There's a ****ing CHILD born in THIS world who needs parents and care, that you made, so you better get up your ass and move instead of filing legal complaints.

appeal to emotion noted and duly discarded.

Well no. Your sperm has turned into a baby? Well TOUGH LUCK buddy.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Az
Why should men be held to more responsiblity than women on the issue?

Who's saying that men are being held to more responsibility? I don't see that anywhere in the thread. Oh, the side that wants men to be able to say, after the fact, that they don't want to deal with the consequences of their actions. Too bad, so sad.

You don't want to take care of a child, don't get someone pregnant.

[Az]

Women are left with the consequences regardless. If men simply run away, than they are being held less responsible than the woman is on the issue. Che is advocating that men be made to deal with the consequences just as the woman has to, so that they are both responsible.

Yes, you're correct. However, with abortion, women are also made less responsible than men. Both should be responsible, and both should have an appropriate amount of choice. Because women will have to obligation to carry the baby for 9 months, they should and have the right to pregnancy for substantial parts of the pregnancy at their will. Men don't have that, yes. However, if they are placed in a position in which they have no choice at all after the pregnancy has started, they are disadvantaged. They should have some choice.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Az

Yes, you're correct. However, with abortion, women are also made less responsible than men.

Abortion isn't a trivial ordeal. Your misogynist attitude is rather disturbing.

Let's compare the two sides

Man: Can run away and pretend nothing happened

Woman: can under go a medical procedure where-in a gestating fetus is killed and removed from her.

[GePap]

It amazes me that the conception that an abortion simply absolves the woman continues.

It has been pointed out several times that an abortion is a medical procedure. It carries risks and costs, and the women regularly suffer psychologically.

This view amazes me more beacause the same people making it don't seem to realize that if the woman gets an abortion, the man is absolved from responsibility completely anyways, without even having to bear the cost of a medical procedure, or any psychological effects-meaning he did make like a bandit.

Guys here want equality? Then say that the men should bear half the cost of the abortion procedure, since they are being left "off the hook" just as the women are, and therefore, shouldn't they at least bear part of the cost?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by General Ludd
Abortion isn't a trivial ordeal.

Actually, it is. The only reason people think it isn't is because of mysogynist ****s who go around saying how traumatic it is. We are conditioned to think it's a big deal, so we make it a big deal in our heads. It doesn't have to be any more of an ordeal than having a tooth pulled. It's certainly far less traumatic on the body than carrying a pregnancy to term (and varries less risks, too).

Be that as it may, no one should have the right to force a person to undergo a medical procedure against their will. Not even parents.

[GePap]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara

Originally posted by General Ludd
Abortion isn't a trivial ordeal.

Actually, it is. The only reason people think it isn't is because of mysogynist ****s who go around saying how traumatic it is. We are conditioned to think it's a big deal, so we make it a big deal in our heads. It doesn't have to be any more of an ordeal than having a tooth pulled. It's certainly far less traumatic on the body than carrying a pregnancy to term (and varries less risks, too).

It depends on the type of abortion, how late into the pregancy it is, and the fact that in general it is less traumatic that carrying to term does not mean that it is not traumatic.

Don't letf the fact that soem abortion opponents want to use the cost of abortion as a way of banning it lead you to minimize the cost of abortion.

[Az]

Abortion isn't a trivial ordeal. Your misogynist attitude is rather disturbing.

Let's compare the two sides

Man: Can run away and pretend nothing happened

Woman: can under go a medical procedure where-in a gestating fetus is killed and removed from her.

And until 3 months, the procedure is rather harmless.

In any case, I wasn't saying that the two cases are equivalent, but I am also not saying that the amount of influence/choice the two people should have is equivalent I am saying is that men should have some say, too.

Guys here want equality? Then say that the men should bear half the cost of the abortion procedure, since they are being left "off the hook" just as the women are, and therefore, shouldn't they at least bear part of the cost?

Isn't that kind of thing free or heavily subsidized?

[GePap]

Originally posted by Az
Isn't that kind of thing free or heavily subsidized?

No. Very little healthcare in the US is.

I don't know how most HMO's handle paying for abortions - I know Medicaid (health insurance for the poor) will pay for it, but there are moves to stop that, given the politics against abortion, and it might be that in a lot of states Medicaid would not pay for it anyways.

[Az]

but doesn't the government still spend a lot on healthcare, besides the private spending?

[Dr Strangelove]

I have to confess that as a young man I once had a close shave with unplanned parenthood. My girlfriend had told me that she was on the pill. Weeks later she announced that she was a week late and might be pregnant. I asked her how that could be since she was on the pill, to which she replied that she had lied. I told her that I would be with her, but that we had a lot to discuss and that she needed to undergo a pregnancy test. A few days later she began her menestrual period. We broke up soon afterwards.

( Come to think of it, maybe she was just trying to dump me. )