Sunnis Hit After Shiite Shrine Blast

[Dinner]

Originally posted by StarLightDeath


Yes, no need to be like the English.

Huh? The English seemed to be especially successful at repressing natives and forcing their system upon the savages.

[KrazyHorse]

There is a myth that the 13th Imam, a mythical son of the 12th Imam, who is called "the hidden Imam

Not quite. The hidden imam is still the 12th imam. He supposedly didn't die, but is waiting to reveal himself again as a saviour.

[Dinner]

OK, it has been 3 years or so since I bothered to read up on the Shia. When I learned I was going to Iraq I read a great deal on its history, the differences between Shia & Sunni (as well as eastern rights Christians such as Assyrians & Chaldians) and much of the demography. I guess I mixed up the 12th Imam and the 13th Imam as being the hidden Imam. The reality is I think it is all rubbish.

[Ted Striker]

We ****ed the place up

It's our job to fix it

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Oerdin
OK, it has been 3 years or so since I bothered to read up on the Shia. When I learned I was going to Iraq I read a great deal on its history, the differences between Shia & Sunni (as well as eastern rights Christians such as Assyrians & Chaldians) and much of the demography. I guess I mixed up the 12th Imam and the 13th Imam as being the hidden Imam. The reality is I think it is all rubbish.

Don't worry dude. I read up on a bunch of this **** last night.

[Imran Siddiqui]

The reality is I think it is all rubbish.

It's a religion, you expect reason and science backing their claims?

[Ted Striker]

By the way I was appalled at the American Embassador to Iraq's remarks this week how he said, (paraprhased) "we're not going to waste American taxpayer money trying to fix this place until you people get your act together!"

WTF was that? We've spent over 15 years blowing the place to hell and then blame the victim?

Is this Dick Cheney shoot a guy in the face and blame him for it logic????

[Gatekeeper]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
We ****ed the place up

It's our job to fix it

Uh-huh. It was all hunky-dory until we got there and ruined it. Bullsh*t.

What our illustrious neo-cons did — without fully realizing (or, perhaps, caring) what the consequences would be — was to invade a part of the world with a half-baked, "freedom is on the march" plan that took the cork (Saddam Hussein) out of a centuries-old bottle, unleashing forces whose reactionary agendas far predate any semblence of democratic ideals.

Two things I hope future U.S. leaders learn from the developing debacle:

1. If you're going to attack and invade another nation, do *not* skimp on the invasion force. It's better to go in with *too much* firepower than too little.

2. Make damn sure to plan for a realistic aftermath. Have divisions of occupation troops ready to go, preferable familiar with the language and customs of the nation being pacified. Have a proper "information dissemination" machine ready to go. Have at least a modicum of support from other major nations. In short, plan for the worst, hope for the best.

**sigh** As it is now, I really don't think a full-blown civil war in Iraq is out of the question. Stupid thing is, people will be dying again in the name of God, and all God can do is probably cry for his/her/its wayward children and care for their tortured souls.

Gatekeeper

[Ted Striker]

You forgot the 10 years that preceded the 2003 invasion where we first destroyed the infrastructure then evaporated it with stupid sanctions.

So yeah we ruined it.

Saddam wasn't a cool guy but Iraqi living standards were alot better until we got involved.

Bottom line, we made things much worse.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
You miss the point. Bush Sr blew it off. Clinton blew it off, FOR 8 YEARS.
Anyway, Hussein's gone. Give them their piece of crap land and move on to Iran..or Syria.

not enough destruction ehh remove the torturer so you can torture yourself... no wander Bush got elected again - you (and the others like you, which there seemt to be many in US) like meaningless destruction

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

I wish people would quit saying invasion.

We invaded. We entered by force and intended to occupy. What else do you need?

no you entered and soldiers with flowers instead of arms were welcoming you! As Karl Rove said "we are an empire now, we create our own reality" and it is obvious that in US there are many takers of "Karls reality".

Like the sig from Rufus

"we were welcomed, but it wasn't a peaceful welcome"


----

all in all it's more than sad

[Lawrence of Arabia]

If say, we had just ended a period of violent and brutal supression of Catholics by Protestants in this country, the Catholics had recently gained control, and there was a brutal Protestant insurrection which had killed many Catholics, and it was St.Patricks Cathedral that got hit, then yes I can see that kind of a reaction.

bad analogy, since Saddam might have been Sunni, but he didnt rule with religious policies, he was a communist.

[SlowwHand]

Our "invasion" is hardly the same as Hussein's invasion of Kuwait, for example.

I don't think it's very seemly to constantly speak of being "too western", yet living here and obtaining education and work.
That borders on obscene.

[Shi Huangdi]

Originally posted by Oerdin


I don't believe the anti-catholic feeling in the US during the 18th and 19th centuries (much less the 20th century) could be charactorized as violent and brutal. The government remained tolerant and protective of religious minorities throughout virtually all of the nation's histories and any violence was localized and minor instead of the systematic pogrom you are implying.

No, religious bigotry in the USA wasn't anywhere neare the levels of violence and supession in Iraq, particularly during the Hussein regime. I was giving a hypothetical, that if those situation I mentioned was the case there could be violence.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by alva
Mkay, how long before it's 'our' fault?

Surely this is because of western .

Iran...The voice of reason again

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11515193/