Danish embassy invaded - Part II

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Az
Italy doesn't sell out

He is a guy from the Northern League party, which is racist, xenophobic, south-Italy-phobic, and Islamophobic (yes, all that).

As such, it is 99% safe to assume that the motivation of his action is hostility toward Muslims, and has nothing to do with an actual defense of free speech (unlike what most newspapers did, including France's Charlie Hebdo).

I definitely wouldn't call it "Italy doesn't sell out". I'd call it "Italian extremists stir hatred for political gain". You should be more cautious than to condone actions whose only aim is to stir hatred. What this guy is doing is just as purposefully provocative and hatemongerish as what the extremist protesters did in Britain.

If you want to look at countries that don't sell out, look at France, Germany or Spain, where the cartoons were published, and where the governments didn't issue apologies nor did ban the newspapers. Don't look at Italy's Northern League, because it's just as bad as any other European far-right party, except that it belongs to the government.

[Pekka]

I can 'whine' about BS laws if I want to. What does international have to do with this?

And the 'law' is about vague as 'syytä epäillä'. This is nothing but an open cheque.

And if you think Tuomioja's action is clearly condemnig the action and not apologizing at all, then you have your butt full of SDP.

[Az]

What this guy is doing is just as purposefully provocative and hatemongerish as what the extremist protesters did in Britain.

Only because of what he is, not because of his actions. Hell, I'd get one of these t-shirts if I could.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Az

What this guy is doing is just as purposefully provocative and hatemongerish as what the extremist protesters did in Britain.

Only because of what he is, not because of his actions. Hell, I'd get one of these t-shirts if I could.

Yes, but you'd also get this one:



For some reason, I doubt he and his ilk would, and I doubt he'd be supportive of anyone who does, especially Muslims...

[Az]

Yes, but you'd also get this one:

A friend of mine has this T-Shirt.

For some reason, I doubt he and his ilk would, and I doubt he'd be supportive of anyone who does, especially Muslims...

Muslim schools

Religious Schools

[Spiffor]

Yes, these people are

You may even add an extra in that they don't even have the decency of accepting religious schools of all confessions, but only theirs. Most religionists in the wets don't even suck so much.

The Northern Leaguers suck. These scum are trying to get political gain here by looking like the guys who stand up for our positive values, whereas they really just stand up for their petty parochialism, and hostility to all things foreign from without (they are even hostile to South Italians FFS).

Don't fall in the trap of believing they are doing something positive.

[Az]

You may even add an extra in that they don't even have the decency of accepting religious schools of all confessions, but only theirs. Most religionists in the wets don't even suck so much.

but in the east they do

[Spiffor]

Yes. As you may already know, I'm not seeing eye-to-eye with religious fanatics

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Spiffor
The Northern Leaguers suck. These scum are trying to get political gain here by looking like the guys who stand up for our positive values, whereas they really just stand up for their petty parochialism, and hostility to all things foreign from without (they are even hostile to South Italians FFS).

Don't fall in the trap of believing they are doing something positive.

I remember when they were just the Lombard League. Parochialism for the Italian north, or parts of it like Lombardy, is hardly that surprising given the history of Italy. Italy didnt go through quite the homogenizing process that France did these last two hundred years.


I can only say, Vive les Pays d'Oc !!!!!

Id have more to say on this, but my copy of Braudel's "The Identity of France" is in the trunk of my wife's car, and i have not had the chance to retrieve it in a couple of days

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Yes. As you may already know, I'm not seeing eye-to-eye with religious fanatics

as opposed to secular fanatics? Id say fanaticism of all kinds s**ks.

[Az]

I'd put it this way - fundamentalists, i.e. people who have some beliefs that cannot be shattered under no pretence, are usually no fun to argue with.

However, secularists can't be branded fundamentalists, since I don't think that "proof of god" really goes around and is easy to obtain.

wrt fanatics, it's just a question of whether imposing your beliefs is fair. To be quite honest, the religious people are much more evil. The vast majority of religious people indoctrinate and brainwash their children about god.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Az
I'd put it this way - fundamentalists, i.e. people who have some beliefs that cannot be shattered under no pretence, are usually no fun to argue with.

However, secularists can't be branded fundamentalists, since I don't think that "proof of god" really goes around and is easy to obtain.

wrt fanatics, it's just a question of whether imposing your beliefs is fair. To be quite honest, the religious people are much more evil. The vast majority of religious people indoctrinate and brainwash their children about god.

I dont much care how someone else raises their children. In any case not in the same category as folks using violence to impose their values, denying the possibility of moderations, being humorless and filled with hatred, killing for ideology, etc, etc. All of which were done by secularist fanatics in the last century.


Fanatics

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Az
However, secularists can't be branded fundamentalists, since I don't think that "proof of god" really goes around and is easy to obtain.
.

and christians cant be branded as muslims, jews cant be branded as christians, etc etc. Sure there always distinctions.

But the PROBLEM here, which we are addressing in this thread, is fanaticism, which is not limited to the religious.

[Az]

I dont much care how someone else raises their children. In any case not in the same category as folks using violence to impose their values, denying the possibility of moderations, being humorless and filled with hatred, killing for ideology, etc, etc. All of which were done by secularist fanatics in the last century.

Indoctrination is indoctrination. The use of force is there, whether it's a systematic use of force (banning of religious congregation) or "decentralized" towards the family unit.

[germanos]

Originally posted by Az
Only because of what he is, not because of his actions. Hell, I'd get one of these t-shirts if I could.

E-mail him. Maybe he'll ship one to you.