US bombs Pakistan

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Arrian
Question:

Would those who are all pissed off over this rather we just invaded Pakistan? What, exactly, are the alternatives? The Pakistani government appears incapable of controlling this area. It appears extremely likely that a good chunk of A-Q is hiding there and using it as a staging ground for attacks into Afganistan. Do we just ignore it? No. Do we attempt to kill our enemies? Yes. Ok, your choice:

1) Use of intel to target specific enemies and drop bombs on them; or

2) Invasion.

[insert Jeopardy music]

-Arrian

3.) Turn India loose

[Arrian]

India and Pakistan both have nukes. Baaaaaad idea.

-Arrian

[Japher]

well, that areas problems would be solved real fast

[Arrian]

Yeah, but the fallout would effect us too, and that's no good. If it just killed them it might be ok

-Arrian

[Japher]

or at least less bad... eh...

[Patroklos]

I don't think China would like that so much, which should concern us a little.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Arrian
Question:

Would those who are all pissed off over this rather we just invaded Pakistan? What, exactly, are the alternatives? The Pakistani government appears incapable of controlling this area. It appears extremely likely that a good chunk of A-Q is hiding there and using it as a staging ground for attacks into Afganistan. Do we just ignore it? No. Do we attempt to kill our enemies? Yes. Ok, your choice:

1) Use of intel to target specific enemies and drop bombs on them; or

2) Invasion.

[insert Jeopardy music]

-Arrian

Or

3) Bribe the Pakistani government sufficiently to allow for sending in troops.

Because in this moronic "war on terror", the fact is that the US already lsot the public relations war, and that is the one battle on which the "war" hinges.

Oh, and the possiblity of the US invading a nuclear armed state of 140 Million people plus, under any conditions, is, well, NONE. Maybe the go-getters should start by imagining why the government in Islamabad is unwilling to move in, and from there try to create a workable strategy. Cause the current one is failing.

[GePap]

Originally posted by PLATO


3.) Turn India loose

The Indian'd don;t work for the US, and there is nothing whatsoever the US could ever do to keep India from "turning loose". I think the threat of millions of its citizens dying is what keeps a lid on things....just an idea.

[Arrian]

You think your option 3 is actually viable, either?

It's a sticky situation, and I don't claim to have the answer.

-Arrian

[Odin]

According to tecumseh's logic the West is so evil we should just let the Islamists come and kill us all.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Arrian
You think your option 3 is actually viable, either?

It's a sticky situation, and I don't claim to have the answer.

-Arrian

Its viable depending on just how much we are willing to spend. If we are not willing to spend, obviously its no viable.

These attacks won't make the Pakistanis move any more, if anything, it makes it HARDER for Pakistan to cooperate by creating even less political incentive.

It would make more sense to violate Pakistani soverignty the hard way and send in human agents- more risky in terms of US lives, but perhaps more successful and less damage in political terms, if done right.

[Arrian]

edit: in response to Odin/crosspost w/Gepap

Pretty much.

Look, Che is defending the US government here. Think about that.

I don't want our armed forces bombing children either, but again, what are we supposed to do here? Pakistan is a bloody mess and it's (IMO) the key battleground right now, right up there with Iraq.

As for hearts and minds... I've come to the conclusion that we lost that particular fight a long time ago. I'm not saying that's a good thing, or that we should just shrug and not care at all, but if you have intel (and yeah, I know intel is not always right) saying that a major leader of your enemy is going to be at such-and-such a place and a certain time, YOU TRY TO KILL THE MUTHER****ER.

-Arrian

[Arrian]

There have been rumors of Americans on the ground in Pakistan for some time now, haven't there? CIA types. Now, that could just be BS rumor. Something tells me that, at times, we've had people actually over there.

-Arrian

[GePap]

I thought POLICY should be based on something more than a thirst for vengence, like seekling what might be closest to actual victory.

We have had this policy for several years now, and it has not done much to "win" anything. Generally, I would think this is the time then to reconsider the strategy in the first place.

[Arrian]

Honestly, it's not about vengence for me. I haven't been angry about 9/11 since, oh, maybe October, 2001.

We must attempt to capture or kill the really hardcore crazies who want to kill us. How to do it is obviously debatable. Especially when they're hiding out in tribal Pakistan.

I suggested that this method (use intel and try to "smart" bomb them) is better than the alternatives. You provided an alternative (bribe Pakistan) that I find ridiculous. The government of Pakistan is largely on our side already (via bribes), but given public opinion in that country, any further bending over by them for us would be dangerous for the continued survival of that regime, don't you think?

I'm fine with reviewing policy. But that also means finding a better way if you deem the old policy bad.

-Arrian